Bach's Chaconne on Guitar

Discussions relating to the classical guitar which don't fit elsewhere.

Re: Bach's Chaconne on Guitar

Postby Leitmotiv » Fri Mar 20, 2009 11:11 am

I attended a John Williams masterclass where this piece was at the centre of a discussion on maintaining traditional values (Guitar festival of Ireland, 2006).


Starting on the second beat of a 3/4 per measure, this accent is carried through the minor, then the major, and you might expect it for the final minor ending.


Not the case!


According to John, the first beat is strong in each measure for the final section.


Pavel Steidel plays the Chaconne. He was present at this discussion also. His reading must be worth a listen.


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Re: Bach's Chaconne on Guitar

Postby Julian » Fri Mar 20, 2009 10:56 pm

Hi Leimotiv, I wish I was there attending the masterclass with John Williams playing Chaconnne in his style of composition.

Yes, I agree about the final section. The way John Williams played for final part was as strong as the very first measures with 'grandeur' or 'maestoso' elements, short of speak.

Chaconne arranged by Bussoni has a major chord. And it was nice. I was thinking to write Chaconne for two guitars. Probably I may do it later.

It would be good if you could share your experience from that masterclass with us.

Julian
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Re: Bach's Chaconne on Guitar

Postby John O » Fri Mar 20, 2009 11:23 pm

Julian wrote:Chaconne arranged by Bussoni has a major chord. And it was nice. I was thinking to write Chaconne for two guitars. Probably I may do it later.Julian


The Amadeus Guitar Duo has already arranged and recorded the Busoni version on their "Dedication" CD: http://www.amadeusduo.com/recordings.shtml

(I assume this is what you meant--or did you mean you would write your own Chaconne?)

Also, Carlo Domeniconi has created his own version of Bach's Chaconne in which he has kept the rhythms and note values but replaced all of the notes! It's quite a wild ride, and from what Dale Kavanaugh told me (be still, Sean :D ), it's much more difficult than Bach's! She has recorded it as well on her "Music for Guitar" CD (catchy title...).
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Re: Bach's Chaconne on Guitar

Postby Julian » Sat Mar 21, 2009 3:00 am

Hi Fugue, thanks for telling me this. I was thinking to write a duo Chaconne for close friends and Delcampers of course, but since someone has done it, it's great.

And I am eager to hear the Domeniconi's Chaconne.

Also there is a duo for Chaconne performed by two angles from Korea. There are marvellous.


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Re: Bach's Chaconne on Guitar

Postby apiacere » Sat Mar 21, 2009 8:04 am

Alexis !

Apart from many great guitarists many of which you know of and which have been listed on here in the replies, I suggest you also listen to some violinists, not for the technique but for the phrasing and interpretation. Many times I find we guitarists focus too much on technique rather than the music. Try Maxim Vengerov, Hillary Hahn and Itzhak Perlman, Victoria Mullova and Jascha Heifetz (all on Youtube). Those will give you the chill :casque:

AP :bye:
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Re: Bach's Chaconne on Guitar

Postby apiacere » Sat Mar 21, 2009 1:19 pm

Julian wrote:There are many fine music for guitar but Bach's Chaconne is an eternal and paramount masterpiece, also on the guitar. Should Bach have been with us today listening to Chaconne, he would have agreed that Chaconne composition was intended for the guitar.

I've listened to Chaconne played by Yehudi Menuhin and Nathan Milstein on violin, Alicia De La Rocha on the piano and more than ten guitarists on the guitar. Without prejudice, I still feel that Chaconne on guitar is the best of all. Since 1975, I've listened to Chaconne played by John WIlliams for more than 1,000 times, and never get bored.

There are a handful of guitarists play that piece beautifully. John Williams on 1961 Fleta, Christopher Parkening on Ramirez, and Franco Platino on Greg Bryer are amongst the best to my ear.

I was so obsessed with the way Mr. Williams played it on his 1961 Fleta. I managed to write Chaconne almost similar to Mr. Williams' arrangement for personal use in fear of violating copyrights infringement. Why John Williams? I think he combined the music and the sound of his Fleta very beautifully. He played with a lot of single notes similar to the original version on the violin, yet we can hear the bass and treble counterpoint notes harmoniously.

After more than 1,000 times listening to Chaconne, I will keep listening it again and again.

Julian


John was here in Sweden a year ago and performed the Chaconne on his Smallman. His playing was absolutely brilliant, phenomenal. Got standing ovations!

AP :okok:
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Re: Bach's Chaconne on Guitar

Postby mpferreira » Sun Mar 22, 2009 12:40 pm

I agree with Martin regarding the need to listen to the Chaconne on the violin. The best I know of played on the baroque violin is by Sigiswald Kuijken, a great specialist on the instrument.

On the guitar, I like the Goran Söllscher version -- he uses his 11-string guitar.
Last edited by mpferreira on Sat Mar 28, 2009 1:50 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Bach's Chaconne on Guitar

Postby Paul » Sun Mar 22, 2009 4:26 pm

A good thread to read through is the How To Improve Interpretation (recently rediscovered by PaulCroft), especially for a piece as challenging as the Chaconne. My feeling is that it's going to take a hell of a lot more than listening to every version under the sun to be able to play it, even if one has the technique. Of course that isn't stopping me from looking for as many versions as possible, but then I'm not about to play it, am I?
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Re: Bach's Chaconne on Guitar

Postby lundquist1992 » Mon Mar 23, 2009 2:05 pm

Fugue wrote:Paul Galbraith: Very slow (19 minutes!) but ever so grand and stately
Eliot Fisk: Fast and furious--yet gripping!
Kazuhito Yamashita: ditto
Frank Bungarten: No-nonsense--very clear and clean
Remi Boucher: (hard to find) mind-blowing scales and very expressive
Pablo Sainz-Villegas (video only): He won the 2006 Parkening with this piece--very expressive



all of theses kind of sucked pablo was ok, parkening and segovia and bream are probably the best
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Re: Bach's Chaconne on Guitar

Postby John O » Mon Mar 23, 2009 4:20 pm

lundquist1992 wrote:
Fugue wrote:Paul Galbraith: Very slow (19 minutes!) but ever so grand and stately
Eliot Fisk: Fast and furious--yet gripping!
Kazuhito Yamashita: ditto
Frank Bungarten: No-nonsense--very clear and clean
Remi Boucher: (hard to find) mind-blowing scales and very expressive
Pablo Sainz-Villegas (video only): He won the 2006 Parkening with this piece--very expressive



all of theses kind of sucked pablo was ok, parkening and segovia and bream are probably the best


:shock: :shock: How insightful. Care to elaborate? (And where did you hear Remi Boucher's? His is a private live recording.)
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Re: Bach's Chaconne on Guitar

Postby avoz » Tue Mar 24, 2009 12:32 pm

[quote="mpferreira"]I agree with Martin regarding the need to listen to the Chaconne on the violin. The best I know of played on the baroque violin is by Sigiswald Kuijken, a great specialist on the instrument.]

mp, I agree with your opinion of the Kuijken recording, but a recent 'authentic' recording by Rachel Podger has received 'rave' reviews and is on a par at least.
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Re: Bach's Chaconne on Guitar

Postby Nick Payne » Sun Mar 29, 2009 6:27 am

I'm surprised that no-one so far has mentioned Göran Söllscher. I think that of the 15 or 20 recordings that I have of the Chaconne on various instruments (violin, lute, guitar, and piano), his 1982 recording of Segovia's transcription is my favourite - a truly great performance. He really makes musical sense of the piece, and his phrasing and articulation are marvellous.

On the subject of the Segovia transcription, is there an errata anywhere for it? E.G. just in the first couple of dozen bars, there are three or four places where he incorrectly shows an eighth note followed by two 16th notes instead of a dotted 8th note followed by two 32nd notes.

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Re: Bach's Chaconne on Guitar

Postby mpferreira » Sun Mar 29, 2009 1:13 pm

Avoz,
Thanks a lot for the information about Rachel Podger's CD. I will certainly be looking for it.

Nick,
I remember having heard the Söllscher recording on the radio many years ago. That was just once and it impressed me a lot. I will probably download his entire rendition of Bach sonatas and partitas (and cello suites) from the Deutsche Gramophon site, if I can't find a real wav CD.

(EDIT):

Nick, I'm sorry -- my information was wrong. I looked the Deutsche Grammophon site and the CD set with both the sonatas and partitas for violin and the suites for cello was recorded, on bowed instruments, by Schlomo Mintz and Misha Maisky. An absolutely fantastic recording, but you will not find the Söllscher version of the Chaconne there.
The set also contains the very good Göran Söllscher CD with the 4 lute suites (on a 11-string guitar).

Best,
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Re: Bach's Chaconne on Guitar

Postby wianno » Sun Mar 29, 2009 4:46 pm

Owl's interpretation was inspiring. It's a shame that it is no longer available in the MP3 library.

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Re: Bach's Chaconne on Guitar

Postby strungup » Thu Apr 02, 2009 9:47 pm

This was the piece that got me into the guitar, played by Bream on his Westminster album of Bach in about 1964. An absolute life-changing moment, because from then on I had an interest in classical music which even Segovia and Williams had not got going.

Thanks Dad!
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