[PDF] Anon.; Doctor O'Neill

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Frank Nordberg

[PDF] Anon.; Doctor O'Neill

Postby Frank Nordberg » Sun Feb 03, 2013 11:14 pm

[Edit 05-02-2013: New files uploaded. If you've downloaded the music before that date you probably want to get a new, corrected copy]

For those of you who like the Cat In the Corner (http://www.classicalguitardelcamp.com/viewtopic.php?f=12&t=75079), here's another one in the same style and from the same source:

This one too comes in two versions, one classical/fingerpicking arrangement:
doctor-oneill-norf-gtr.pdf

And one for those who play with a plectrum and for those who want two alternative versions to combine into a longer piece:
doctor-oneill-norf-gf.pdf


If you want tablature, try this link:
http://www.classicalguitardelcamp.com/viewtopic.php?f=103&t=75091
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.
Last edited by Frank Nordberg on Tue Feb 05, 2013 2:21 am, edited 3 times in total.

AlexRaven
Posts: 104
Joined: Fri Jan 25, 2013 6:35 am
Location: Irkutsk, Russia

Re: [PDF] Anon.; Doctor O'Neill

Postby AlexRaven » Mon Feb 04, 2013 6:29 am

A nice and lively piece. But i don't understand what is "dropped tuning"? And the second point : in your BPM indication I see dot after quarter note. Is it misprint or your tempo intention in standard BPM must be 120-200?
Alex Raven
Is there - is there balm in Gilead? - tell me - tell me, I implore!'
Quoth the raven, `Nevermore

Frank Nordberg

Re: [PDF] Anon.; Doctor O'Neill

Postby Frank Nordberg » Mon Feb 04, 2013 8:28 am

AlexRaven wrote:A nice and lively piece. But i don't understand what is "dropped tuning"?


Not "dropped" but "double dropped":
  • Dropped D tuning: DADGBE - that is 6th string tuned down to D.
  • Double dropped tuning: DGDGBE - that is 5th string tuned down to G and 6th string down to D.
But I got it wrong, this one's in standard tuning. Was working on a set of double jigs and some of the others are in dropped D or double dropped tuning. Got a bit confused wehen I wrote that comment. Sorry.

AlexRaven wrote:And the second point : in your BPM indication I see dot after quarter note. Is it misprint or your tempo intention in standard BPM must be 120-200?


It is not a misprint. Like most music in 6/8 time, the jig has two beats to the bar so you count the dotted fourth notes.

To give you some idea of tempo, here are moderately fast concert versions ot "Doctor O'Neill":
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2-tmQwJoQWc
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4GYgRlZVNpU
Some musicians play it considerably faster. Seems there's no upper limit to the tempo of an Irish jig.

And here is the dance:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xSUnKdoAXhA
Not the same tune but the tempo is the same.

I just noticed that the fifth part is missing from my arrangement. I'll posty a corrected version of it later today.

edgradwell
Posts: 65
Joined: Sun Dec 23, 2012 12:09 pm
Location: Bolton, Lancashire, England

Re: [PDF] Anon.; Doctor O'Neill

Postby edgradwell » Wed Feb 13, 2013 7:35 pm

Thanks for that well-fingered piece Frank. My modest collection of celtic tunes is steadily growing! You wouldn't happen to have a version of 'Blind Mary' (I think by Turlough O'Carolan)? It's a beautiful tune and I would love to have a version of it to play on the guitar. Ed.

Frank Nordberg

Re: [PDF] Anon.; Doctor O'Neill

Postby Frank Nordberg » Wed Feb 13, 2013 11:55 pm

edgradwell wrote:You wouldn't happen to have a version of 'Blind Mary' (I think by Turlough O'Carolan)? It's a beautiful tune and I would love to have a version of it to play on the guitar. Ed.


Ummm... errr...

I was actually planning to arrange all of O'Carolan's known tunes for guitar but the fact is I have too much respect for his music so I'm too scared I'll mess it up. There's also a question of style. O'Carolan was equally influenced by the ancient Irish harps traditions and by the popular Italian music of his time (Vivaldi etc.). Should I approach the music as medieval or as baroque? Of course, the versions of his tunes we know today are from O'Neill's "Music of Ireland" and may have been a bit romaticised - perhaps it might be just as well to late romanitc folk style? Or - since we are living in the 21st century after all - perhaps a modern folk or modern classical guitar approach would be better? Five completely different styles that all would be appropriate and we can only choose one.

Oh well, I'll see what I can do. I've already written a bass line and a guitar accompaniment to "Blind Mary", so it won't take more than a few minutes of work to cook up a solo guitar version. Need some thinking first though. But I need a bit of thinking first although I'm sure for this tune I'll end up with a modern folk approach.

edgradwell
Posts: 65
Joined: Sun Dec 23, 2012 12:09 pm
Location: Bolton, Lancashire, England

Re: [PDF] Anon.; Doctor O'Neill

Postby edgradwell » Thu Feb 14, 2013 9:59 am

Hi Frank. I'm glad to hear you have the makings of a version of Blind Mary, and I'm sorry if I've put you on the spot regards how to approach which style to use. I agree with you that O'Carolan is a rather special composer and some thought and respect needs to be applied when arranging his songs. Blind Mary is such a beautiful tune however that I'm convinced that the romantic approach would be suitable. I've never thought of his music as medieval, but I have sometimes thought that with his wonderful gift for melody he reminds me of a sort of Irish Bach! Anyway it's good to hear that other people out there admire him.

I have sometimes thought that it would be nice to arrange this kind of music for guitar, but I'm scared of taking the plunge, as my harmony skills are not what they should be. Ah well, perhaps when I retire I will have the time to have a try at it. Ed.

AlexRaven
Posts: 104
Joined: Fri Jan 25, 2013 6:35 am
Location: Irkutsk, Russia

Re: [PDF] Anon.; Doctor O'Neill

Postby AlexRaven » Thu Feb 14, 2013 2:07 pm

edgradwell writes:
I have sometimes thought that it would be nice to arrange this kind of music for guitar, but I'm scared of taking the plunge, as my harmony skills are not what they should be

Cohey Minami made some guitar arrangement of O'Carolan pieces. I have seen Farewell to Music, Welcom, Hewlett, Mr.O'Connor and Jig. You can find these pieces via Web search. I cannot give you the reference to his site - for some reasons which are not clear to me this reference is forbidden on Classicalguitardelcamp.com.
Alex Raven
Is there - is there balm in Gilead? - tell me - tell me, I implore!'
Quoth the raven, `Nevermore

edgradwell
Posts: 65
Joined: Sun Dec 23, 2012 12:09 pm
Location: Bolton, Lancashire, England

Re: [PDF] Anon.; Doctor O'Neill

Postby edgradwell » Thu Feb 14, 2013 7:31 pm

Thanks for the info on the O'Carolan/Minami pieces. I found them easily enough. I haven't played them yet, and at first glance they look a little daunting. I've spotted a book called the Celtic Guitar Encyclopedia on Amazon by Glenn Weiser which contains over a 100 tunes, 21 of which are composed by O'Carolan. (No Blind Mary however!) Have you come across him by any chance, and if so is he a good arranger? Ed.

Frank Nordberg

Re: [PDF] Anon.; Doctor O'Neill

Postby Frank Nordberg » Thu Feb 14, 2013 11:35 pm

edgradwell wrote:Hi Frank. I'm glad to hear you have the makings of a version of Blind Mary, and I'm sorry if I've put you on the spot regards how to approach which style to use.


No worries, challenges like that is what makes the arrangement work interesting. Just writing basic classical guitar arrangements of folk/folkish songs tend to be a bit boring - it's just too easy! :wink:

I ended up choosing a modern folk music approach. Interestingly, it turned out as something that could also easily pass as a 17th century lute arrangement even though I didn't have that in mind at all.

You can find my arrangement at http://www.classicalguitardelcamp.com/viewtopic.php?f=12&t=75410.

edgradwell wrote:I've never thought of his music as medieval


Well, medieval is perhaps not the right word but 17th century Irish harpers tended to be quite conservative, playing in a style more in line with music trends from a century or three earlier. O'Carolan was sometimes criticized by his contemporary colleagues for being too modern.

AlexRaven wrote:Cohey Minami made some guitar arrangement of O'Carolan pieces.


I also just noticed there are quite a few O'Carolan arrangements on this message board.

AlexRaven wrote:I cannot give you the reference to his site - for some reasons which are not clear to me this reference is forbidden on Classicalguitardelcamp.com.


That would be Tony Wilkinson's site. I tried to link to it myself in another context and when I asked one of the moderators why I couldn't, I was told that they were a bit unsure whether that site is free of copyright infringements and besides, even if it is, it's way too commercial. Personally I also have issues with the quality of that site, not just the massive amount of annoying ads but also with the music itself. Wilkinson's own transcriptions are quite good. He's a really good music typesetter and he doesn't do any editing at all, just copying directly whatever earlier edition he works from. Unfortunately he has chosen to also fill up his site with Alvarez butcheries and other rubbish transcriptions he's picked up across the web so the overall quality level is uneven to put it mildly.

AlexRaven
Posts: 104
Joined: Fri Jan 25, 2013 6:35 am
Location: Irkutsk, Russia

Re: [PDF] Anon.; Doctor O'Neill

Postby AlexRaven » Thu Feb 14, 2013 11:57 pm

Frank Nordberg writes :
That would be Tony Wilkinson's site
No, I mean Cohey Minami personal Japan site. It is not commercial resource. Although part of text in Japanese and needs special browser plug-ins for correct displaying , you can easily locate English references to sheet music files. Anyway, the files that I mentioned can be found on some other sheet music sites. Just enter in search engine the string 'Minami guitar' followed by composer name or composition title.
Alex Raven
Is there - is there balm in Gilead? - tell me - tell me, I implore!'
Quoth the raven, `Nevermore


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