Sor, Fernando - op.35/17 - D04 - Gut Strings/No nails

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tateharmann
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Re: Sor, Fernando - op.35/17 - D04 - Gut Strings/No nails

Post by tateharmann » Tue Jun 06, 2017 4:18 am

Thank you!
"Speed is the enemy of emotion." - Emilio Pujol Vilarrubi

Francisco
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Re: Sor, Fernando - op.35/17 - D04 - Gut Strings/No nails

Post by Francisco » Tue Jun 06, 2017 5:15 pm

tateharmann wrote:
Mon Jun 05, 2017 6:35 pm
No problem - glad to answer any questions :)
How long have you been playing without nails ?
Less than 2 years, I think about 1 year and 9 months. Unfortunately it does take some time to start sounding nice - and I'm not even close to where I'd like to be in terms of tone. There are others here that sound much better than me lol.
What is the total cost of the set you are using (Aquilas and Gamuts) ?
The Aquila's are $13 US for the whole set (basses and trebles - nice to have spare trebles for when the gut ones break hehe) the Gamut's are as follows: 3rd: $14, 2nd: $10, 1st: $7 - this adds up to a total of $45 or so. But these are by no means the cheapest option out there it's just that they sound good.
How long would they last (playing about 1 hour a day on average)
I think you are on par with me there as far as playing time goes. Other factors to consider are your body chemistry (like do you sweat a lot and it is the acidic type that will eat through the strings?), where you live (Quebec, right?) because humid places will annihilate those strings quickly, and if you're using nails or not. For me, I live in Minnesota, USA where I would venture a guess that our climates are fairly similar.. so we are good there. I, of course, play without nails and I'm not a big sweater (is that even a word?). The first string to go will be the high E 1st (I usually buy 2 at a time)- but under my personal conditions they last over 2 months. The 2nd string can last 6 months or more and the 3rd over a year!

Hope that helps
Thank you!
Yamaha GC42S

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tateharmann
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Re: Sor, Fernando - op.35/17 - D04 - Gut Strings/No nails

Post by tateharmann » Tue Jun 06, 2017 10:52 pm

No problem, it's my pleasure ;)
"Speed is the enemy of emotion." - Emilio Pujol Vilarrubi

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tateharmann
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Re: Sor, Fernando - op.35/17 - D04 - Gut Strings/No nails

Post by tateharmann » Fri Jun 09, 2017 3:37 am

In case anyone else is following this thread or others with regard to gut strings and flesh playing I made a quick demo of the range of the guitar. This is starting on the open E 6th string all the up to 1st string 19th fret. These strings retain their sound all the way up the range. I'm playing the basses with free strokes and the trebles with rest strokes, though. Oh, and this is the straight sound off of the guitar - no effects or anything else:

https://soundcloud.com/laguitarraclasic ... man-guitar
"Speed is the enemy of emotion." - Emilio Pujol Vilarrubi

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tateharmann
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Re: Sor, Fernando - op.35/17 - D04 - Gut Strings/No nails

Post by tateharmann » Tue Aug 22, 2017 4:38 pm

I decided to redo this recording for a couple of reasons. First, the original was rather quiet/distant. Second, I found some discrepancies in the notation I was using compared to others. For anyone who's interested or is familiar with this study, it has to do with the third-to-the-last measure, #30 on the fourth beat. The original notation I used has a low open 6th string E with an open 2nd string B. However, I've found more than one other score that notates this beat as a low 6th string, 3rd fret G with the same B. I don't know what Sor originally wrote, but I quite like the version with the G :) So I played it that way for this recording, see what I'm describing here:
Screenshot from 2017-08-22 11-35-56.png
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powderedtoastman
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Re: Sor, Fernando - op.35/17 - D04 - Gut Strings/No nails

Post by powderedtoastman » Thu Aug 24, 2017 5:24 pm

Nicely done! The re-do sounds a little more crisp in the trebles than the first one, did you mix it differently or anything?

On the first one I was thinking I would like to hear the transition between the melody notes a little more smooth/legato because they were a little abrupt, but that's improved this time around as well.

An interesting note by the way, I recently switched from Aquila Alabastro to Ambra on my Lacote copy per a friend's recommendation, and I really like them. The first set I got were a smooth/glossy finish which I think I prefer. When I liked those I ordered a few more sets, but the next handful I got (from Strings By Mail) came with a rough texture like they're rectified or something. That makes them very similar to the gut strings I tried when I first got the guitar. Could be a very inexpensive alternative to real gut if they keep making them this way, and if you find that they work well enough!

I don't really love the rough texture so much, feels weird on my left hand fingers and scratches on my nails on the right hand (as tempting as it is I don't know if I'm ready to go no-nails since I still do like the sound I get with my nails on my spanish-style guitar) but they do sound very good!
Oddly, they also stayed in tune very nicely on my first playing session just one day after I changed them. You can hear my first crack at them on Carulli Op. 333 in the next sub-forum over.

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tateharmann
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Re: Sor, Fernando - op.35/17 - D04 - Gut Strings/No nails

Post by tateharmann » Sat Aug 26, 2017 4:05 am

Thanks for the feedback, I appreciate that.

I didn't really mix anything differently this time, I just find that the tone produced by the fingertips gets better and better with time. I'm still finding ways to make the sound production more articulate after 2 years.

I have tried the Ambras and I must say, I wasn't a fan of them. I do have a pack of Aquila Perlas waiting for this guitar when this set of gut aren't playable anymore. I suspect this will take a while though, as the gut I'm using here by Dan Larson is super fine quality. The high E is going on 3 months and is barely starting to fray. I actually don't like a rough texture on the treble either and Mr Larson's are very smooth, indeed.

I will check out your Carulli, for sure!

Regards,
Tate
"Speed is the enemy of emotion." - Emilio Pujol Vilarrubi

powderedtoastman
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Re: Sor, Fernando - op.35/17 - D04 - Gut Strings/No nails

Post by powderedtoastman » Sun Aug 27, 2017 12:10 am

tateharmann wrote:
Sat Aug 26, 2017 4:05 am
I'm still finding ways to make the sound production more articulate after 2 years.
That is kind of why I'm hesitant to go no-nails.. now that I've figured out basically how to take care of my nails and get the sound I like out of them, I don't want to go through that reboot process and have to re-tweak my right hand technique. That and my more modern guitar sounds great with nylon strings and I kind of doubt it would work well with gut. I've tried Alabastro nylgut on it and it was OK but I eventually came back to Augustine regal blue which gives a thicker and fuller tone in the trebles. Not crazy about the basses but I'm too lazy to mix and match much.

I do envy you for zoning in on a good sound without nails! Keeping my nails has made me quit certain other hobbies... but that just means more time to work on my guitar playing!

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tateharmann
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Re: Sor, Fernando - op.35/17 - D04 - Gut Strings/No nails

Post by tateharmann » Sun Aug 27, 2017 1:00 pm

Yes, it's not fun to have to re-learn technique, it's said that Tarrega took a year or so to revamp his technique after cutting his nails off. For me, I just had to try it, though :) I also am saving up for a lute and would also like to get into baroque guitar so it was a natural progression to remove the nails :)

You can play without nails on modern guitars and nylon strings too. Here's some Diabelli I recorded on an Antonio Aparicio with high tension Hannabach strings: https://m.soundcloud.com/laguitarraclas ... o-aparicio

That being said, you're sound is great...if it ain't broke don't fix it!! Haha
"Speed is the enemy of emotion." - Emilio Pujol Vilarrubi

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