for people who know about ABRSM grades

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delayedMusician

for people who know about ABRSM grades

Post by delayedMusician » Tue Oct 28, 2014 11:15 am

is it acceptable to think of the Delcamp books 1-9 as the corresponding grades for ABRSM or similar grades? I don't know much about the Delcamp books yet, I have a couple of old editions that I downloaded somewhere.

Yeah I know: it's not realistic to think of grades, etc.....heard it all before. I don't see ABRSM grades as a salvation to anything or the only way to define goals etc, just as ONE valid ways amongst others. Also, I am an advanced musician, although it's only been a few months that I started out on classical guitar and I have been progressing quickly (to my own surprise).
I am just mentioning all this to avoid wasting our time with too basic advice like 'nah, ABRSM isn't this or that'. The grades is what they are.....a way to build a basic but solid complement to your other musical activities. My point is just whether it's ok to see the Delcamp books as progressive from complete beginner to pretty much complete pro, in a gradual way. Am I correct?

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pogmoor
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Re: for people who know about ABRSM grades

Post by pogmoor » Tue Oct 28, 2014 12:11 pm

delayedMusician wrote:is it acceptable to think of the Delcamp books 1-9 as the corresponding grades for ABRSM or similar grades? I don't know much about the Delcamp books yet, I have a couple of old editions that I downloaded somewhere.
Roughly speaking, yes. Music grading systems of this sort are aimed at rating the music from easy to difficult. ABRSM and Trinity College grades run from 1 - 8 and beyond grade 8 there are higher diplomas. Delcamp grades run from 1 - 12, with 10 - 12 representing masterpieces of the repertoire that would be regarded as beyond ABRSM or Trinity grade 8 . So, as you say, it would be reasonable to think of Delcamp 1 - 9 as corresponding to ABRSM or Trinity grades 1 - 8. Having said that assigning pieces to grades is very subjective, and it is not unusual to find the same piece 1 or 2 grades different in the different systems.
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Yamaha (SLG 130NW silent classical guitar 2014).

delayedMusician

Re: for people who know about ABRSM grades

Post by delayedMusician » Tue Oct 28, 2014 2:27 pm

perfect explanation, thanks :)

Tea Toradze

Re: for people who know about ABRSM grades

Post by Tea Toradze » Tue Apr 12, 2016 10:29 pm

pogmoor wrote:
delayedMusician wrote:is it acceptable to think of the Delcamp books 1-9 as the corresponding grades for ABRSM or similar grades? I don't know much about the Delcamp books yet, I have a couple of old editions that I downloaded somewhere.
Roughly speaking, yes. Music grading systems of this sort are aimed at rating the music from easy to difficult. ABRSM and Trinity College grades run from 1 - 8 and beyond grade 8 there are higher diplomas. Delcamp grades run from 1 - 12, with 10 - 12 representing masterpieces of the repertoire that would be regarded as beyond ABRSM or Trinity grade 8 . So, as you say, it would be reasonable to think of Delcamp 1 - 9 as corresponding to ABRSM or Trinity grades 1 - 8. Having said that assigning pieces to grades is very subjective, and it is not unusual to find the same piece 1 or 2 grades different in the different systems.
Thank you for the answer pogmoor and sorry if I bring this old topic up.
Would you recommend one relying on passing through the on-line course here alone to then be confident enough in taking ABRSM or Trinity graded exams? One will probably have enough understanding and practice to prepare required exam pieces but what about theory, scales, aural test, etc. or maybe there is some hidden knowledge being shared/acquired with face-to-face teacher-to-pupil interaction that otherwise could be missed? Would be very encouraging to know if anyone has actually attempted graded exams mainly relying on the knowledge and skills gained from on-line course.

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Stephen Kenyon
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Re: for people who know about ABRSM grades

Post by Stephen Kenyon » Tue Apr 12, 2016 11:17 pm

Tea Toradze wrote:...or maybe there is some hidden knowledge being shared/acquired with face-to-face teacher-to-pupil interaction that otherwise could be missed? ....
Nobody is hiding the knowledge but inevitably there are things that arise in many teacher-pupil interactions that cannot really be simulated otherwise - that's a good deal of what the student is paying for.

But at the same time, so long as you are competent with scales and arpeggios, there is no reason to think they are any different from pieces in terms of the overall accuracy etc that may be required. Aural tests and sight reading are inevitably harder to do DIY because one may not know whether the results are appropriate or not. Except again that with aural tests, in general on can check one's answer afterwards with due attention. And even with sightreading, you could test yourself (perhaps on a recording) and then exhaustively check over the result for accuracy.

As ever, the mantra is likely to be - get some lessons!
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Re: for people who know about ABRSM grades

Post by mmapag » Wed Apr 13, 2016 8:37 pm

Stephen Kenyon wrote:
Tea Toradze wrote:...or maybe there is some hidden knowledge being shared/acquired with face-to-face teacher-to-pupil interaction that otherwise could be missed? ....
Nobody is hiding the knowledge but inevitably there are things that arise in many teacher-pupil interactions that cannot really be simulated otherwise - that's a good deal of what the student is paying for.

But at the same time, so long as you are competent with scales and arpeggios, there is no reason to think they are any different from pieces in terms of the overall accuracy etc that may be required. Aural tests and sight reading are inevitably harder to do DIY because one may not know whether the results are appropriate or not. Except again that with aural tests, in general on can check one's answer afterwards with due attention. And even with sightreading, you could test yourself (perhaps on a recording) and then exhaustively check over the result for accuracy.

As ever, the mantra is likely to be - get some lessons!
Stephen pretty much nails it here. I don't believe anyone can become truly proficient musically and technically without benefit of a competent teacher. There is just too much to it and too many subtleties to be an autodidact.
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Re: for people who know about ABRSM grades

Post by Alan Green » Wed Apr 13, 2016 8:52 pm

You can download samples of the aural parts of the ABRSM exams from their website.

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Re: for people who know about ABRSM grades

Post by George Crocket » Wed Apr 13, 2016 9:19 pm

Alan Green wrote:You can download samples of the aural parts of the ABRSM exams from their website.
There is also an ABRSM iPhone app which coaches for the aural tests.
George
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Tea Toradze

Re: for people who know about ABRSM grades

Post by Tea Toradze » Wed Apr 13, 2016 11:21 pm

Stephen Kenyon wrote:
Tea Toradze wrote:...or maybe there is some hidden knowledge being shared/acquired with face-to-face teacher-to-pupil interaction that otherwise could be missed? ....
Nobody is hiding the knowledge but inevitably there are things that arise in many teacher-pupil interactions that cannot really be simulated otherwise - that's a good deal of what the student is paying for.
that's pretty fair point
As ever, the mantra is likely to be - get some lessons!
I have to agree on this point too for me personally
mmapag wrote:I don't believe anyone can become truly proficient musically and technically without benefit of a competent teacher. There is just too much to it and too many subtleties to be an autodidact.
There have already been a few apparently
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_autodidacts
life is full of surprises and I hope there will be more to come those poor guitar genius autodidacts somewhere amongst us humans :wink:

Tea Toradze

Re: for people who know about ABRSM grades

Post by Tea Toradze » Wed Apr 13, 2016 11:40 pm

George Crocket wrote:
Alan Green wrote:You can download samples of the aural parts of the ABRSM exams from their website.
There is also an ABRSM iPhone app which coaches for the aural tests.
Thanks Alan Green and George Crocket, I am aware of these.

I have also discovered recommendation for speeds for exam scales that might be useful guide for some
http://gb.abrsm.org/en/our-exams/inform ... e-speeds/#

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Re: for people who know about ABRSM grades

Post by mmapag » Thu Apr 14, 2016 12:01 am

Tea Toradze wrote:
Stephen Kenyon wrote:
Tea Toradze wrote:...or maybe there is some hidden knowledge being shared/acquired with face-to-face teacher-to-pupil interaction that otherwise could be missed? ....
Nobody is hiding the knowledge but inevitably there are things that arise in many teacher-pupil interactions that cannot really be simulated otherwise - that's a good deal of what the student is paying for.
that's pretty fair point
As ever, the mantra is likely to be - get some lessons!
I have to agree on this point too for me personally
mmapag wrote:I don't believe anyone can become truly proficient musically and technically without benefit of a competent teacher. There is just too much to it and too many subtleties to be an autodidact.
There have already been a few apparently
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_autodidacts
life is full of surprises and I htope there will be more to come those poor guitar genius autodidacts somewhere amongst us humans :wink:
In the history of man Tea, that is a very short list and bereft of classical guitarist. You can try to be the one in a million or play the percentages. The choice is yours.
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Stephen Kenyon
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Re: for people who know about ABRSM grades

Post by Stephen Kenyon » Thu Apr 14, 2016 6:34 am

Tea Toradze wrote:...
I have also discovered recommendation for speeds for exam scales that might be useful guide for some
http://gb.abrsm.org/en/our-exams/inform ... e-speeds/#
The speeds are also listed in the scale book of course.
Simon Ambridge Series 40 (2005)
Trevor Semple Series 88 (1992)
Louis Panormo (1838)
Alexander Batov Baroque Guitar (2013)
Simon Ambridge 'Hauser' (2018)

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