notation software -which to use

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hav

notation software -which to use

Post by hav » Mon Apr 18, 2005 1:33 pm

To make it easier for those who may be looking for such software - I'll try and keep this first entry in the thread updated with a list of the software discussed herein (so, if you suggest another package, please include the name and website url for it so that I can add it to the list):

1. LilyPond http://www.lilypond.org/
free - very full featured - manual data entry
reportedly, NoteEdit provides a gui

2. Finale - http://www.finalemusic.com/
commercial package

3. ScoreWriter - http://www.geniesoft.biz/
commercial



Hi folks - I was playing a bit with notation software - just a whim and nothing I want to spend a lot of money on - but I was wondering if there were recommendations for a fairly good but inexpensive program for notation?

I have tried Finale Notepad and Score Writer. Of these two, I prefer Score Writer - but both (apparently) lack support for notating harmonics - and score writer seems to lack marking for - well not sure of the name of the mark - for a fast arpeggio on a chord) etc.

Also, score writer results in difficult to read stems on notes - examples in the attached PDF -- m6 has really bad example - also m16 & 17 etc. - all over really - and could never figure out how to notate the harmonics (so there are places which would just be played WRONG!)

Any other suggestions for programs to use.

(Bob - if you see this, maybe you could also ask JF though I suspect his is not inexpensive)[/list][/list]
Last edited by hav on Fri Apr 29, 2005 4:30 pm, edited 1 time in total.

BobM

Post by BobM » Tue Apr 19, 2005 3:32 am

Sure Hav, I will also go to the other forum and check out the transcription section for you. I'll get back.

Bob

Garlik

Post by Garlik » Tue Apr 19, 2005 11:34 pm

Try lilypond http://www.lilypond.org/web/
I use NoteEdit http://developer.berlios.de/projects/noteedit
noteedit can export to lilypond

All are Free and under GPL

hav

Post by hav » Wed Apr 20, 2005 12:33 am

yup - I have been playing with lilypond today and for sure it is nice and will handle all this very well --- of course, I MAY just have a conniption fit before I get through a 60 (or so) measure polyphonic piece of music :-D

I'll go look at noteEdit as a front end -- thanks!!

Bandersnatch

Post by Bandersnatch » Wed Apr 20, 2005 1:31 am

Hi guys

Anybody knows of a Mac compatible notation software? I know Finale makes a version specific for the guitar for around $100 us dollars but I wonder if there is cheaper comparable software for the mac?

Chees :D

Alan

Post by Alan » Wed Apr 20, 2005 3:53 am

Hi,

I downloaded Lilypond yesterday into my Windows XP and NOTHING HAPPENS :twisted: I simply can't use it.

I mailed to what I thought was their support servce, and all I got back was an e-mail telling me that since I wasn't a member, my query was being held.

I tried deleting it from my hard disk, because it is a darn heavy piece of software, and this also seems to be impossible !

Can anybody help ?

Alan

hav

Post by hav » Wed Apr 20, 2005 4:03 am

Hey Bandersnatch - yes - lilypond seems to have a macOS version available - all free -- http://lilypond.org/web/install/

Hi Alan - yeah - LOL - lilypond is heavy (especially if you grab the entire cygwin distribution (as I did - what the heck - I have wanted it anyway) -- like 3.5 GB installed -- WOW.

but it all seems to work fine for me - downloaded the setup.exe - installed (which took quite a while to download and install) -- then grabbed the example .ly file from the LP site - saved it in a local dir - opened win explorer and double clicked the .ly file - it ran lilypond and creaded and displayed a pdf of the demo .ly file - all seemed ok

but I have to tell ya - hand coding the file for anything but a trival piece is probably going to be a monster!!

I managed only about 20 measures today - LOL -- and I'm not sure they are great -- a very old thing I did long long ago. But, for fun, if you're interested,

I tried to attach my .ly file so you could poke around in it -- but the forum doesn't allow files with the .ly extension - sorry

I THINK uninstall of lilypond is just a matter of deleting the entire cygwin dir (unless you installed elsewhere-- shame shame shame :-)

BobM

Post by BobM » Wed Apr 20, 2005 11:49 am

Hi Hav, I see you got your answers. 8) I found your message on the french side and I guess it all amounts to lilypond for now. I'll keep looking but forgive me if I'm a bit slow, lately, between work, kids and guitar I've had very little time.

See you around,

Bob

hav

Post by hav » Fri Apr 29, 2005 3:51 am

Ok - well I guess Lilypond wins ( http://www.lilypond.org/ )

It does a pretty good job of rendering the score - still some problems but they seem to be making improvements fairly rapidly.

Anyway - here's an exemple - I know JF doesn't want folks to upload a bunch of copies of pdf's - so I'll just point to a pdf of the Prelude - it's cleaned up and has some fingering added. I'll improve it as new versions of LilyPond are released and just replace the pdf file located at...

http://www.hav.com/junk/scores/Vallas_P ... av73-1.pdf

Fingering support in LilyPond 2.4 (which seems to be the newest version currently available for W2k) is only partially supported - and it still lacks things like support for string numbering and harmonic numbering with fingerings -- also, the placement of numbers for plain fingering can still be problematic for chords etc.

Still - a VERY nice program and very frustr... ummm ... I mean - FUN to use Very Happy

jrethorst
Posts: 150
Joined: Tue Dec 21, 2004 2:52 am

Re: notation software -which to use

Post by jrethorst » Fri Apr 29, 2005 4:18 am

hav wrote:Of these two, I prefer Score Writer - but both (apparently) lack support for notating harmonics - and score writer seems to lack marking for - well not sure of the name of the mark - for a fast arpeggio on a chord) etc.

Also, score writer results in difficult to read stems on notes - examples in the attached PDF -- m6 has really bad example - also m16 & 17 etc. - all over really - and could never figure out how to notate the harmonics (so there are places which would just be played WRONG!)
I use Overture, from the same publisher, and give it high marks. Looking at the Score Writer (mac) demo, I see the hollow diamond for harmonics in the Note Head palette. The arpeggio mark is on the Articulations palette - choose it and click on a note in a chord to place the mark before that note. With the arrow tool, drag either end up or down to include all notes in the chord.

In m6, are all your notes in one voice? Score Writer gives you four. Default stem direction can be set for all of them. Or, flip the stems on the two colliding notes.

In m16, the rest must be in one voice and the note in another. Just drag the rest so it doesn't collide with the note.

In m16 and 17, the doubled beams - do you have notes superimposed on others? Otherwise, choose Redraw from the Score menu to see if that cleans it up. Otherwise, it's a bug and the publisher would like to know about it.

There's a _lot_ of informed discussion at the publisher's forum:

http://geniesoft.com/forum/

hav

Post by hav » Fri Apr 29, 2005 2:33 pm

Hi jrethorst - actually, I did play with scoreWriter a bit more and did find the noteheads - but, as I remember, when I selected the harmonic head, it placed an un-stemmed note on B (mid cleft) and I could not get it to do otherwise.

It was really really irritating that the scorewriter demo wouldn't allow me to save the file though -- forcing a potential customer to totally restart each time he has a few minutes to play with the demo seems, to me at least, a less than well considered way to gain customers ;)

Anyway - though the learning curve for LilyPond is certainly higher and it's way more time consuming to do the data entry, I think I'll probably stay with it for now. Heck, I really do very little writing (none in the last 20 years or so :D -- so it's not a big deal for me.

I did prefer scoreWriter (what I could see of it in the demo) over Finale.

Guitarman2005

I use Noteworthy Composer

Post by Guitarman2005 » Sat Apr 30, 2005 7:32 am

HI.
What about Noteworthy Composer ?

It si quite easy to use, not very expensive, and it puts a very little load on computer memory (RAM).

This product can import *** Please no direct link to a file. Point to the homepage of the corresponding site *** files and can also play the scores.

You can exclude the parts that you dont' want to ear on a SATB piece.

Even the playback of chords is very good.

You can find it here...
http://www.noteworthysoftware.com

Guitarman2005

cconsaul

Don't Forget Sibelius

Post by cconsaul » Sat Apr 30, 2005 11:39 pm

I use an old dinosaur of a program called Music Printer Plus myself, but if I ever get a couple of hundred dollars ahead, I am going to get an educational copy of Sibelius. The learning curve is a little bit lower than Finale, and it doesn't seem quite so scary to me.

On the lower end of the financial spectrum, there is also Tabledit, and Guitar Pro (3 and 4) which will usually only set you back under a hundred bucks. I am amazed at how much music is written for Guitar pro by the way.

I haven't looked at Finale in awhile by the way. We were supposed to learn about the basics in College and the Professor was too invested in his personal time to devote any to the class. The Department head didn't take any action, so I switched colleges, but never did master Finale. A freind offered to put one of his old legitimate copies on my machine for a couple of months to let me fool around with it, but he couldn't get it installed. that kind of put me off personally, but Finale is kind of an industry standard when it comes to sending stuff off to a publisher. Apparently they can take what you put into Finale and just about paste it into a finished publication with very little trouble. If I was going to be a world famous author, I would definately take that into consideration, after verifying it with my own personal publisher first of course.

By the way, if anybody knows where I can get the last update of Music Printer Plus (the one that will scan it's own stuff back into the program) I would be greatful to get that. My copy is licensed and legitimate, but I think the company is vanished into the ether. It's a DOS based program, you can only do a 64kb file with it, and it doesn't run too smooth at all on XP unless you convert the properties to let it run as a 98 or a 95 type program, but it gets the job done, it doesn't take me all night to do it, and it lets me put things where I want them pretty much. I wish I wasn't such a dinosaur, I know that there's a tar pit out there waiting for me, but in the meantime, just call me Dino!

Darrin_Smith

scores?

Post by Darrin_Smith » Thu Jun 16, 2005 3:33 am

I would recommend guitar pro

billb

Post by billb » Fri Jun 17, 2005 12:01 pm

The best notation software you could ever use is music publisher.

You can down load the evaluation for free.

Check out this transcription I did using it.

It also has midi.

It is by far the best and I have used them all.

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