How to try different classical guitars when buying one?

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CG-phile
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Re: How to try different classical guitars when buying one?

Post by CG-phile » Wed Oct 20, 2010 2:39 pm

alexphyd wrote:I also find interesting the picture on the web page you posted, with the strut structure: can it be I just "missed" them then somehow?
The Clarita Negra by Boaz Elkayam has a sound hole in the same spot as a Bastien Burlot guitar, but beyond that, why would you assume the strut structure is the same? Photos on Bastein Burlot's website reveal a different, more traditional internal structure; definitely not Kasha inspired as is the case with Boaz Elkayam's guitars.
"Classical guitar... my escape from everyday technocentrism!"

need2Practice

Re: How to try different classical guitars when buying one?

Post by need2Practice » Wed Oct 20, 2010 2:54 pm

alexphyd wrote: I also find interesting the picture on the web page you posted, with the strut structure: can it be I just "missed" them then somehow?
I don't see how you could have missed the struts if they were there. It's more likely that Burlot has taken the same basic idea in a different direction.
alexphyd wrote: I wonder how many professional guitarists regularly play these kind of guitars...
One thing about us guitarists is we really notice what others (especially pros) are playing :D There's a list on this forum of "professionals and their guitars" that does a pretty good job of documenting who plays what. Also, most websites are quick to point out their most famous customers. For whatever reason, I think guitars with very large ports are still fringe instruments and have yet to gain much of a following by either pros or amateurs.
alexphyd wrote: And yes, I have started playing as many guitars as possible (I think I really tired at one point the people at the shop where I bought the latest one, which is of course only a "passage" one towards a more professional instrument):))
Ah, I bought a couple of "passage" guitars as well. I still have one and use it as my backup in environments that might be hostile to my Trezzini. Be careful, those "extra" guitars have a way of piling up on you! :D

alexphyd

Re: How to try different classical guitars when buying one?

Post by alexphyd » Thu Oct 21, 2010 10:26 am

Hi CG-phile,

There is a misunderstanding, I did not assume that the two guitars are similar, I was just wondering whether it could be that I missed the presence of the strut fan somehow...of course the two fans would be very different no doubt. As Darrell said maybe Burlot uses a new approach altogether...

Darrell, ineed "passage" guitars can be a problem, especially since I tend not to sell/give them away:) (I feel a strong attachment, even if I don't play them anymore, as they remind me of a certain period of my life).

Cheers,

Ale

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CG-phile
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Re: How to try different classical guitars when buying one?

Post by CG-phile » Thu Oct 21, 2010 1:38 pm

alexphyd wrote:As Darrell said maybe Burlot uses a new approach altogether...
CG-phile wrote:Photos on Bastein Burlot's website reveal a different, more traditional internal structure; definitely not Kasha inspired as is the case with Boaz Elkayam's guitars.
"Classical guitar... my escape from everyday technocentrism!"

alexphyd

Re: How to try different classical guitars when buying one?

Post by alexphyd » Thu Oct 21, 2010 2:04 pm

Indeed I definitely agree with you AND Darrell that the two guitars are very diffrent;)

From one photo one can guess 7 struts? Maybe I just did not see them because of the dim light in the guitar shop.

Cheers,

Ale

Jeff Robertson
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Re: How to try different classical guitars when buying one?

Post by Jeff Robertson » Fri Oct 22, 2010 8:19 pm

I typically go about this is a very systematic way.

1. I make sure it stays in tune after some hard strumming and rasgueados
2. I make sure the intonation is correct (or as correct as it can be) with my digital tuner
3. I play some chromatic exercises, checking for buzzing or any other unusual behavior from the 1st through the 15th frets.
4. I often will look inside the guitar, check the neck joint, inspect the french polish, etc... to determine if the build quality meets my criteria.

If I get past all of this and the overall tone of the guitar sounds good to my ear then I'll start playing pieces on the guitar... This works for me. I also typically bring a great guitar with me for comparison purposes....this to me is a must.

Good luck!
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Re: How to try different classical guitars when buying one?

Post by GeoffB » Fri Oct 22, 2010 8:54 pm

Hi oasisguitar, welcome to the forum! Could I invite you to introduce yourself here?

Geoff
Classical Guitar Forum.

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alexphyd

Re: How to try different classical guitars when buying one?

Post by alexphyd » Sat Oct 23, 2010 9:15 am

I never thought of bringing a good guitar for comparison when buying a new one, but few people have already mentioned this...

I wonder, would you also do this when going directly to the Luthier to try one of his/her guitars? They would probably be ok with this I guess...

I once saw a video of John Williams speaking to Greg Smallman, and at one point taking out his guitar as a comparison, which was however still a Smallman:)

Cheers,

Ale

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James Lister
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Re: How to try different classical guitars when buying one?

Post by James Lister » Sat Oct 23, 2010 10:21 am

alexphyd wrote:I never thought of bringing a good guitar for comparison when buying a new one, but few people have already mentioned this...
I wonder, would you also do this when going directly to the Luthier to try one of his/her guitars? They would probably be ok with this I guess...
I certainly don't have a problem with this, in fact I would encourage it. Mostly players will bring their current instrument for comparison, so that it's easy to see what they are gaining. One of the few (possibly only) disadvantages of buying from an individual luthier is that you can't compare guitars from different makers side by side. A while ago I was looking into the idea of setting up a studio representing a small number of luthiers where prospective customers could come to try out different guitars, and meet the makers at the same time. I think it's an ideal solution, but quite difficult to do in practice.

James
James Lister, luthier, Sheffield UK

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Waddy Thomson
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Re: How to try different classical guitars when buying one?

Post by Waddy Thomson » Sat Oct 23, 2010 10:52 pm

It is a great idea, though!
Waddy

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alexphyd

Re: How to try different classical guitars when buying one?

Post by alexphyd » Sun Oct 24, 2010 1:45 pm

What about Luthier's events/competitions/exhibitions?
Occasionally you have such events where guitars from different luthiers can be seen side by side, but of course I am not really sure that people are allowed/encouraged to play the instruments in the first place, although some concerts are organized where professionals play them...In some of them the best guitars are selected and awarded a prize.
Speaking of which, it would be great if there was a section/calendar with all these events (per country/continent:): I somehow always miss them for few weeks:(

Cheers,

Ale

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Re: How to try different classical guitars when buying one?

Post by henders » Sun Feb 20, 2011 2:31 pm

riffmeister wrote:
alexphyd wrote:The question maybe is: what are the characteristics of a great guitar, and how do you make them emerge, provided of course you know how to play?
Easy to play in the left and right hands. Tunes easily and intonates well. Strong 1st string all the way up the neck. Good volume and well-balanced in all registers, both up and down the neck and across strings. Responds well to right hand timbral changes. Good sustain. No dead notes. Beautiful to look at.

Very good advice. Playability first, aesthetics last.

philhh

Re: How to try different classical guitars when buying one?

Post by philhh » Mon Mar 14, 2011 11:54 pm

jstroud wrote:excellent point what goes is it if it sounds great but you cant play it like the old rameriz 664's
Glad to hear I'm not the only one who thought they were unplayable! I had an '82 664mm Ramirez 1a when I was 15 and it was a beast. I was so excited to be getting a Ramirez but could never play it very well...

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