Bridge saddle removing question ?

Construction and repair of Classical Guitar and related instruments
andylefty

Bridge saddle removing question ?

Post by andylefty » Mon Oct 02, 2006 10:59 am

Image

Ok i'm thinking of buying this yamaha guitar, but i have to convert it to left handed. now the thing is that it has a cutout slot for the G string which Yamaha say helps intonation.(you can just about see it in that photo)

I was wondering how you can remove the bridge saddle? does it just tap out or is it glued in place? as it looks to me i would have to take it out and just turn it around to convert to lefty??

but i'm not really sure if this is possible, are saddles the same width throughout :?:

Nando

Post by Nando » Mon Oct 02, 2006 5:57 pm

They can be removed easily, no glue involved. Same width throughout.

dlmoak

Post by dlmoak » Mon Oct 02, 2006 6:16 pm

As Nando said, they are nto attached and can come out without a problem. I can't quite tell from the photo, but it looks like the slot for the saddle is at an angle to the tie block. This would probably cause tuning issues if you reversed the strings.

andylefty

Post by andylefty » Mon Oct 02, 2006 7:54 pm

Image

this picture is slightly clearer, the cutout looks to go straight across the whole bridge and is wide enough not to matter. so i guess it would be ok?

Carnbo

Post by Carnbo » Mon Oct 02, 2006 10:27 pm

dlmoak wrote:As Nando said, they are nto attached and can come out without a problem. I can't quite tell from the photo, but it looks like the slot for the saddle is at an angle to the tie block. This would probably cause tuning issues if you reversed the strings.
Its more than that - the saddle is higher at the sixth string than at the first string as well as angled to the strings. This is normal compensation and if the strings were reversed I believe you would have tuning problems - the octave at the 12th fret would probably not be true.
I am no luthier but I think that to create a true left handed guitar you would have to fit a new bridge with the saddle angles reversed.

Nando

Post by Nando » Tue Oct 03, 2006 1:24 am

Most classical guitars do not have an angled saddle. Maybe if you post a pic of the bridge head on we could tell.

anathem

Post by anathem » Tue Oct 03, 2006 8:18 am

doesn't look angled to me. it can be moved simply as someone said before

andylefty

Post by andylefty » Tue Oct 03, 2006 1:03 pm

Well i emailed the shop i would buy it from to see if they could do it for me, that way its down to them...

no reply yet..

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Michael
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Post by Michael » Fri Oct 06, 2006 12:08 pm

One thing you have to be more careful about when converting a RH guitar to LH, is the nut.

You would have to have a new nut cut to mirror image the large and small slots.Some nuts are made with very shallow slots but the majority are cut with the string width in mind.

The shop would not be interested in doing this for you and it would have to be carried out by a luthier at extra cost to you, I am sure.

As for the angled saddle, you don't really need to angle the saddle as it depends upon the height of action you require. Sometimes, just using the same saddle and turning it round in the bridge slot will suffice, providing it hasn't been specially machined for intonation.
All the good music has already been written by people with wigs and stuff.
(Frank Zappa)

Carnbo

Post by Carnbo » Fri Oct 06, 2006 1:02 pm

Michael wrote:As for the angled saddle, you don't really need to angle the saddle as it depends upon the height of action you require. Sometimes, just using the same saddle and turning it round in the bridge slot will suffice, providing it hasn't been specially machined for intonation.
I agree with you about the nut, but there is also another saddle angle to consider the angle across the bridge which effectively makes the 6th string longer than the first string. I think this is done to compensate and achieve a true octave on all strings. So if you reverse the strings you lose that compensation and with the saddle reversed the strings would not be running over the saddle correctly - the saddle is not symetrical, there is a ramp over which the string rides and you would reverse this.
I think this is why some makers explicitly manufacture Left Handed guitars, there is a lot more to it than just reversing the strings.

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Michael
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Post by Michael » Fri Oct 06, 2006 9:57 pm

Carnbo wrote:I agree with you about the nut, but there is also another saddle angle to consider the angle across the bridge which effectively makes the 6th string longer than the first string. I think this is done to compensate and achieve a true octave on all strings. So if you reverse the strings you lose that compensation and with the saddle reversed the strings would not be running over the saddle correctly - the saddle is not symetrical, there is a ramp over which the string rides and you would reverse this.
I think this is why some makers explicitly manufacture Left Handed guitars, there is a lot more to it than just reversing the strings.
Very true, in the case of steel string guitars where the slot in the bridge is angled for the reasons you say. My Yamaha APX6 is a case in point (but is a cutaway, so, useless to consider as a LH conversion!) but both my classical guitar's bridge slots are perpendicular to the frets so I would imagine switching the saddle round would suffice in this case, providing the saddle is machined uniformly.
All the good music has already been written by people with wigs and stuff.
(Frank Zappa)

Carnbo

Post by Carnbo » Fri Oct 06, 2006 10:30 pm

Very true, in the case of steel string guitars where the slot in the bridge is angled for the reasons you say. My Yamaha APX6 is a case in point (but is a cutaway, so, useless to consider as a LH conversion!) but both my classical guitar's bridge slots are perpendicular to the frets so I would imagine switching the saddle round would suffice in this case, providing the saddle is machined uniformly.
My Alhambra 9c has the saddle angles I described and I have seen quite a few classical guitars with this arrangement but I agree not everyone is. however, if you look at the pics posted above it looks to me that the guitar shown also has the double angle I'm talking about.

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Michael
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Post by Michael » Sat Oct 07, 2006 6:49 am

Carnbo wrote:
however, if you look at the pics posted above it looks to me that the guitar shown also has the double angle I'm talking about.
I had another look at the pictures and yes, I can see what you mean.
It is difficult to tell as one of the pictures looks straight and the other one doesn't. The oblique height of the saddle seems to distort the image slightly.
A picture taken perpendicular to the guitar would help.

Some modern guitars have two or three offset mounted saddles now don't they, thus taking perfection of intonation to another level?
All the good music has already been written by people with wigs and stuff.
(Frank Zappa)

andylefty

Post by andylefty » Sat Oct 07, 2006 2:42 pm

I spotted this instrument for sale:

http://www.eaglemusicshop.com/lefthande ... cessType=1
A fantastic value solid top classical guitar built in Romania. The fan brased internal construction enables us to convert a right hand model to this left hand model.
Image


So this looks just like a straight right to left flipover to me :?: has anyone heard of this brand Hokada?

I don't have a lot of money to spend on a new guitar, obviously it isn't going to be £$£$£ high quality, but does it look ok? it has at least a solid top??

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