D02 Classical guitar lesson 1

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PDF, MP3, Vidéos, Lessons : Level D01 - Level D02 - Level D03 - Level D04 - Level D05 - Level D06 - Level D07 - Level D08 - Level D09 - Level D10 - Level D11 - Level D12.
Peter Johnson

Re: D02 Lesson 1

Post by Peter Johnson » Sun Nov 21, 2010 3:07 pm

Well done Irene!
I wonder how you recorded that. What did you use? I only have some old microphone with was part of a webcam. Still, maybe I could use it with Audacity. It does sort of work.
I also found the nail length of the m finger very important, i.e. keep it short. Which I generally find I have to do anyway but this technique of rest strokes really shows any faults with one's fingers and placement/position. With my short nails I like to think I'm in good company with the likes of Sor - I wish...

Michael Collings
Posts: 212
Joined: Tue Mar 03, 2009 3:58 pm
Location: Sylva, North Carolina

Re: D02 Lesson 1

Post by Michael Collings » Sun Nov 21, 2010 3:12 pm

Irene, thanks for posting. Your rest strokes are coming through nice and strong. Posting at a slower-than-suggested tempo is perhaps a good idea for those of us who can't play up to speed yet (the hardest piece on this lesson for me is "Old MacDonald" which I still can't play up to speed!)

BTW I also use bevelled fingernails (which I had to shorten after beginning these lessons.)

I also agree with pmb379, that it can take more than a couple weeks of practicing to "perfect" a piece. Consequently, it may be wise to post at slow tempi for now with the idea of posting "improved" versions later (as Charlsoln suggested).

Irene Tirtajana

Re: D02 Lesson 1

Post by Irene Tirtajana » Sun Nov 21, 2010 3:35 pm

Peter Johnson wrote:Well done Irene!
I wonder how you recorded that. What did you use? I only have some old microphone with was part of a webcam. Still, maybe I could use it with Audacity. It does sort of work.
I also found the nail length of the m finger very important, i.e. keep it short. Which I generally find I have to do anyway but this technique of rest strokes really shows any faults with one's fingers and placement/position. With my short nails I like to think I'm in good company with the likes of Sor - I wish...
Hi Peter, thanks for the encouraging reply! :merci:

I used the native recording device on my notebook computer, a Lenovo, using Audacity. Afterwards I did a tiny amplification (2.6 decibels).

Yes, this is a really good exercise to work on rest stroke techniques. I will continue to practise it even after today!

Irene Tirtajana

Re: D02 Lesson 1

Post by Irene Tirtajana » Sun Nov 21, 2010 3:38 pm

Michael Collings wrote:Irene, thanks for posting. Your rest strokes are coming through nice and strong. Posting at a slower-than-suggested tempo is perhaps a good idea for those of us who can't play up to speed yet (the hardest piece on this lesson for me is "Old MacDonald" which I still can't play up to speed!)

BTW I also use bevelled fingernails (which I had to shorten after beginning these lessons.)

I also agree with pmb379, that it can take more than a couple weeks of practicing to "perfect" a piece. Consequently, it may be wise to post at slow tempi for now with the idea of posting "improved" versions later (as Charlsoln suggested).

Wow, thanks for the kind assessment, Michael!

Yours ain't shabby either :bravo:

In fact it was your recording of Danse dAvilla that inspired me to work on this!

Yep, we should all open a "late homework" thread at the recording forum... :mrgreen:

RyanDG

Re: D02 Lesson 1

Post by RyanDG » Mon Nov 22, 2010 12:47 am

p58 n16 Buté - Apoyando - Rest stroke
00:00 - 00:30

ANONYME (1750) DANSE D'AVILA with rest strokes (apoyando).
00:36 - 01:10

Stephen Collins FOSTER (1826-1864) OH! SUSANNA with rest strokes (apoyando).
01:16 - 02:32

ANONYME (1750) QUE NE SUIS-JE LA FOUGÈRE with free strokes (tirando)
02:36 - END

[media]https://youtu.be/reNUY-i3R9g[/media]

Jack Jarrett

Re: D02 Lesson 1

Post by Jack Jarrett » Mon Nov 22, 2010 12:52 am

It's reassuring to know many of us are experiencing the same difficulities and have similar ideas of this type of learning experience. What a great opportunity we have with this!

Regarding the difficulty of getting a good take, I spent an hour and a half recording the lessons with my digital camera, trying many of the simplest pieces over and over, keeping only the ones with the least amount of mistakes, loaded them onto my computer, named them and watched them (another half hour).It was then I realized my hand was not centered in the lens, hence only one or two fingers are visible! :( I deleted most of them, and vowed to purchase a cheap tripod rather than using books and various implements to use as shims for my camera. I also realized that for some reason, while trying to perform the rest strokes, I slowly moved my hand away from the sound hole and was near the saddle. Another thing to think about while performing these "simple" excersices! I have decided to post my recordings at the last minute no matter how bad I think they are.I know in time I will relook at them and realize how far I've progressed!
Jack

Jack Jarrett

Re: D02 Lesson 1

Post by Jack Jarrett » Mon Nov 22, 2010 12:59 am

Wow Ryan, that was really nicely done. You are really looking very relaxed and your rest strokes look quite natural.
You make it look easy!
Jack

RyanDG

Re: D02 Lesson 1

Post by RyanDG » Mon Nov 22, 2010 9:35 am

Thank you Jack!
I had a lot of trouble the first few days, but once I trimmed my nails and moved my thumb more towards the neck it went much better.

Bryan Jeffrey

Re: D02 Lesson 1

Post by Bryan Jeffrey » Mon Nov 22, 2010 1:08 pm

After just 1 lesson this course has really exceeded my expectations. The lesson appeared fairly straightforward and I thought I would breeze through (I've played off and on for 20 years). Once I went to practice though I realized I had a lot of work to do - I felt like I was starting all over! Here are the things I have learned, all of which have been brought up in this forum already:

1. Right hand position (can't play #16 otherwise)
2. Execution of rest stroke (both thumb & fingers)
3. Damping open strings with the thumb
4. Playing pieces all the way through (in order to record/video)

Mr. Delcamp is obviously a superior teacher to be able to accomplish this without any direct input. What has been extremely satisfying is to go back and play pieces that I have known for years with this newly gained knowledge and technique. This is when you can really feel that you have made progress.

Irene Tirtajana

Re: D02 Lesson 1

Post by Irene Tirtajana » Mon Nov 22, 2010 3:04 pm

Smooth performance, Ryan! :chitarrista:

I can only comment on Danse d'Avilla because that's the only piece I learned. I noticed you used p to do rest strokes on the 6th and 5th strings one after another. The score advised p for 6th string followed by i for 5th string, so that i will damp the 6th string automatically with no extra movement. Then you can rest the thumb on 5th string, thus damping it, while sounding the repeated middle A on the 2nd string. I'd never have thought of it myself - was doing it like you did and using the thumb to damp 6th string in between strokes - until it just dawned on me that it was a technique Mr D brilliantly slipped into the piece.

Michael Collings
Posts: 212
Joined: Tue Mar 03, 2009 3:58 pm
Location: Sylva, North Carolina

Re: D02 Lesson 1

Post by Michael Collings » Mon Nov 22, 2010 5:54 pm

Hello RyanDG,

I really respect the way you posted all these seamlessly. That is a very courageous (and fair) way to approach video posting- especially for lessons!

[quote="RyanDG"]p58 n16 Buté - Apoyando - Rest stroke
00:00 - 00:30

Great job- better than I can do!

ANONYME (1750) DANSE D'AVILA with rest strokes (apoyando).
00:36 - 01:10

Really nice work on the rest strokes. Watch out for letting the low E ring out while you are playing the low A string. In M. Delcamp's video you can see his thumb immediately return to the E string after playing the A (in m. 3). I just noticed that I failed to do this a couple times on my video too!

Stephen Collins FOSTER (1826-1864) OH! SUSANNA with rest strokes (apoyando).
01:16 - 02:32

Watch rhythms at mm. 4,8,12,16 etc. basically anywhere there is a pause. This seemed better on the second run-through but the beats were still a little shortchanged. One thing that M. Delcamp emphasizes is counting the subdivisions of each beat as you play-especially when you are not playing (as in a rest or held note).

ANONYME (1750) QUE NE SUIS-JE LA FOUGÈRE with free strokes (tirando)
02:36 - END

Nice full sound throughout. Again, watch the rests at mm. 4,8,12 etc. I noticed that M. Delcamp shortchanged these rests as well (certainly for expressive purposes instead of ignorance). However, he fully stopped the strings from vibrating on the rest. In this way one "plays" the rests- they are just as important as the notes. Similarly, one needs to dampen the open bass strings as soon as beat 2 occurs so that the low A and E on mm. 1 and 2 only last one beat and no more.

Jeremy Hickerson
Amateur luthier
Posts: 625
Joined: Tue Feb 03, 2009 5:20 am
Location: Salem, Oregon

Re: D02 Lesson 1

Post by Jeremy Hickerson » Mon Nov 22, 2010 5:59 pm

Just some encouragement to Greg - I think you will get better by "doing" over time, you just have to keep believing it, because you won't see the change for a while. I think some of this has to do with building up left and right hand strength so that you have the strength for a good hand position. This kind of muscle building will take a while, and if you stop out of discouragement then it won't happen. So even if you don't see results keep playing anyway and they will come.

I am in the D03 group, and I also have to say that these pieces (including the D01 exercises) seem simple but are very hard because they highlight technique (or lack of it in my case!).

I also think it may help for recording to read from the music rather than memorizing. I taped the music I was playing to a cupboard about the same height as the webcam so that I could look at it (it was maybe 6 feet away, but I could see the notes well enough to keep my bearings in the music). I think it takes a while to really memorize a piece, and part of the problem with recording mistake free is making sure you remember what comes next in time before the next note is due. If you take this out of the equation I think you have a much better chance. Of course it's harder to play without looking at your fingers (although in some ways it's easier, try it and you'll see). One of the best tips I ever got from a very high-level teacher was "don't look at your fingers".

I will still say that even when reading music I find it very hard to do error-free takes. But you also get the advantage of choosing the best one, which you won't get in a real performance, so there is something of a trade-off. I do think there's something about it that makes it harder than live performance though.
Jeremy

Guitarras: 1973 Manouk Papazian (Spruce/Morado), two I have built, and an old Telesforo Julve parlor size

Stewart Doyle

Re: D02 Lesson 1

Post by Stewart Doyle » Mon Nov 22, 2010 8:33 pm

As Michael said, Ryan deserves a great deal of respect for posting the exercises and pieces in one 'take' - and I wish I could be that relaxed in front of the camera! I think this is probably closest to what M. Delcamp wanted - after all, few teachers would have the time to sit through multiple attempts.
I'm also impressed with Michael's supportive comments for Ryan. Having posted some beautiful versions of the pieces he could have sat back and waited for the next lesson, but instead took the time to make his valuable comments. Time for my first smiley, I hope it's an appropriate use... For Michael: :bravo:
Well done to Irene too for posting the mp3 and also for her last post which puzzled me at first. My version of Danse D'avila uses p for all the low Es and As, but I suddenly noticed the use of i for the low A in bar 8 (at the start of the second yellow section), repeated later and right at the end. So thanks Irene, although I'll have to re-learn that section now :wink: Speaking of which, time to practice.... Stewart

Jeremy Hickerson
Amateur luthier
Posts: 625
Joined: Tue Feb 03, 2009 5:20 am
Location: Salem, Oregon

Re: D02 Lesson 1

Post by Jeremy Hickerson » Mon Nov 22, 2010 10:08 pm

Yes, a single take post of all the pieces is quite an accomplishment!
Jeremy

Guitarras: 1973 Manouk Papazian (Spruce/Morado), two I have built, and an old Telesforo Julve parlor size

RyanDG

Re: D02 Lesson 1

Post by RyanDG » Mon Nov 22, 2010 10:30 pm

Thank you for the great feedback, especially Michael! I'll be working on my damping/fingering and rhythm.

At first I also wanted to edit and cut out my best takes, but then I noticed it takes quit some time to look up and cut out the good parts.
So I guess its more a case of laziness than boldness hehe.

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