D02 Classical guitar lesson 5

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Jack Jarrett

Re: D02 Classical guitar lesson 5

Post by Jack Jarrett » Fri Feb 18, 2011 2:55 am

Thanks Stewart, that is exactly the kind of feedback I need. I forget sometimes to go back and listen to what M. Delcamp plays, as I get so caught up in playing myself and don't remember what it is supposed to sound like! There is a huge difference in what I played and M.Delcamp.I was trying way too hard for that echo he described in his topic on the piece, and was shooting for a tone difference, the heavier sound higher up the strings contrasted with the metallic sound near the bridge. It doesn't work well though, and his lighter touch and smoother playing is much nicer. Back to the drawing board for me.
Jack

Stewart Doyle
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Location: Yorkshire,UK

Re: D02 Classical guitar lesson 5

Post by Stewart Doyle » Sat Feb 19, 2011 11:01 am

Hi Jack, I'm pleased you found it useful. I went back and looked again at M. delcamp's Danse Polonaise and with Richard's observations in mind. I realized that there is heavy use of rubato in the piece - (I think that's the right term). The rubato makes it something people might dance to, in strict time it would probably have the wrong 'feel' - a polonaise for robots perhaps? I now feel more enthused about the piece, whether I can show any of that in a recording is another matter!
Similarly, I think, although I haven't seen it confirmed anywhere, M.Delcamp wants the scales to have a certain degree of musicality about them (as long as the right technique is there) to perhaps help with the creation of the recording, not just with the listening. Hence the crescendo, decrescendo, the longer note length on the octaves and even some vibrato.
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Richard Judge

Re: D02 Classical guitar lesson 5

Post by Richard Judge » Sat Feb 19, 2011 11:54 am

Here are my performances. My fretting fingers are not getting close enough up to the frets so there is an occasional buzz. What do people think of my right hand position? Comparing the scales to the pieces.
There are still some false starts that are not posted :oops:
Allegretto
[media]https://youtu.be/ziGl19p-KqQ[/media]

Andante affettuosa
[media]https://youtu.be/kcsL6CttF74[/media]

Danse Polonaise
[media]https://youtu.be/WR51ydgINyk[/media]

DoMajeur
[media]https://youtu.be/7VnkNUXIJtk[/media]

Duk Lee

Re: D02 Classical guitar lesson 5

Post by Duk Lee » Sat Feb 19, 2011 3:42 pm

RichardJ wrote:What do people think of my right hand position? Comparing the scales to the pieces.
Richard, I think your RH position is very good and relaxed. It may be tiny bend upward according to what I have heard from some guitar teachers. but you are creating nice tones with smooth plucking. I also noticed in your Domajor scale practice your RH was adjusted a little to accomodate pma plucking. Probably the angle and postion you showed on Domajor is the ideal position of RH, I suspect. I like your scales in terms of flowness of each notes and both RH and LH positions.

Each piece sounds good. You are definitely ahead of me on this. If I could suggest one area is that.... you sounded nice and flowing for arpeggiated areas in Andante Affettuoso, but in the areas of 4 stepping-down notes (like E-D-C-B) I feel less smooth: sounded staccato, rather than legato.
Maybe that is your own interpretation of the piece...... I do not know.

Thank you for sharing your videos.

I will try to catch up over this weekend.
-Duk

Jack Jarrett

Re: D02 Classical guitar lesson 5

Post by Jack Jarrett » Sat Feb 19, 2011 6:10 pm

Richard, I thought your playing was very smooth and had nice tone and sound.How are you recording? Are you using a laptop with a mic plugged in?It really is a good quality sound.

The Allegreto is your best, very smooth with great tone.Nice job! The Andante, I was thinking maybe your left hand needs more arch or curve in it to move the palm a little further from the neck,but I'm no authority.Now that I have a new laptop, I may try recording with that and see if I can hook up my Edirol to use as a microphone,

Keep up the great posts
Jack
Last edited by Jack Jarrett on Sun Feb 20, 2011 6:00 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Stewart Doyle
Student of the online lessons
Posts: 342
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Location: Yorkshire,UK

Re: D02 Classical guitar lesson 5

Post by Stewart Doyle » Sat Feb 19, 2011 6:36 pm

RichardJ wrote: There are still some false starts that are not posted :oops:
I hope this is the same for most of us! Without that I'd be submitting a video lasting about 30 minutes and saying, take a look at the version that starts just after 23 minutes in.... :)
Richard, I think your RH position looks good for the pieces and the scales. If it is better to have the knuckles parallel to the strings then perhaps it's slightly 'better' in the scales and you can see more of an angle in the wrist, but I think it's quite tiring to maintain that angle.
I really enjoyed your Allegretto, the echo on the C major argeggio is particularly well done. Perhaps you could work on getting the same smoothness in the call/response sections of the Andante. As you said earlier, like me, you are playing the Polonaise in strict time. For my second attempt, I think I'll try to incorporate the rubato of M. Delcamp's version.
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Richard Judge

Re: D02 Classical guitar lesson 5

Post by Richard Judge » Mon Feb 21, 2011 9:34 am

Thanks all fort your input.
Probably the angle and postion you showed on Domajor is the ideal position of RH, I suspect.
If it is better to have the knuckles parallel to the strings then perhaps it's slightly 'better' in the scales and you can see more of an angle in the wrist, but I think it's quite tiring to maintain that angle.
This is what I think the right hand knuckles should be more in line with the strings. I didn't notice the difference until I reviewed the video. I will review this and see what difference it makes.
left hand needs more arch or curve in it to move the palm a little further from the neck,
I notice now the thumb peeking over the neck just a tad. With all the concentration on right hand damping I think my left is getting a little sloppy.

Ergonomic review this week I think.
The Allegreto is your best, very smooth with great tone.Nice job!
:merci:

PS I use a Samson GoMic plugged into a Netbook. I think the Mic is excellent but the Netbook doesn't have enough grunt to get the video and sound in sync and at the best quality.

Duk Lee

Re: D02 Classical guitar lesson 5

Post by Duk Lee » Tue Feb 22, 2011 2:35 pm

Hello,

Here are my practices.
I was glad to be able to use my right index finger for Allegretto. It is not fully functional, but slowly coming back, it seems.
[media]https://youtu.be/wHNU0Asa46w[/media],
[media]https://youtu.be/hYgvcZb0V8A[/media]
Thanks.

-duk

Richard Judge

Re: D02 Classical guitar lesson 5

Post by Richard Judge » Wed Feb 23, 2011 9:09 am

Hi Duk
Thanks for your comments on my playing.
If I could suggest one area is that.... you sounded nice and flowing for arpeggiated areas in Andante Affettuoso, but in the areas of 4 stepping-down notes (like E-D-C-B) I feel less smooth: sounded staccato, rather than legato.
Maybe that is your own interpretation of the piece...... I do not know.
I don't consciously make the downward runs more staccato they just come out that way. I am trying to damp the bass during the downward runs as indicated by the rest and I think this makes them stand out a bit.

On your playing.
Nicely played with a good steady tempo. I would try to get a "normal" position a little more over the soundhole to give a greater contrast between the echo parts.

I particularily like the little face appearing over your right shoulder in your scale :D

Duk Lee

Re: D02 Classical guitar lesson 5

Post by Duk Lee » Wed Feb 23, 2011 1:38 pm

RichardJ wrote:I would try to get a "normal" position a little more over the soundhole to give a greater contrast between the echo parts.

I particularily like the little face appearing over your right shoulder in your scale :D
Yes, I have noticed my right hand is little too far away from the sound hole. Perhaps, it is one of my "not-so-good" habits. I will work on plucking closer the sound hole. My whole body seems twisted a little, too. :chaud:

That little face is my son. He always try to help me around... :D

I am glad you enjoyed the little face behind. :)

-duk

Stewart Doyle
Student of the online lessons
Posts: 342
Joined: Sat Nov 06, 2010 9:43 pm
Location: Yorkshire,UK

Re: D02 Classical guitar lesson 5

Post by Stewart Doyle » Thu Feb 24, 2011 9:32 pm

Hi Duk, your Allegretto is well played but I too think it would be better with a higher RH position to give a softer tone, at least for one section. It's not easy to tell - have you put the damping in fully yet? (I've often omitted it for my first try).
I've noticed the top A in your scale is slightly clipped or staccato. (Incidentally, I went back to listen to my attempt and realised I've got the note length completely wrong, even though I highlighted that fact within my own post, albeit later.)

More generally, I'm not sure why the first set of damping is present in the Allegretto as it seems to run counter to the general 'ringing bell' effect. Does anyone with more knowledge of these things have a answer?
I have found Richard's tip about circling the thumb around useful for damping, but I'm not sure how best to damp the low E in bar 4 of the Andante Affettuoso (or 5 if you count the part bar at the start). You can't use the thumb as you need the low E to sound until the thumb plays the E an octave above. I'm trying to place the third finger on the sixth string at the same time the second finger is used for the second E - does anyone else have a better suggestion? I'm hoping the additional time for this lesson (until 15 March) might allow me to master more damping than I usually manage.
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Jack Jarrett

Re: D02 Classical guitar lesson 5

Post by Jack Jarrett » Fri Feb 25, 2011 5:43 am

Duk, nice job! I am a little intimidated at how smooth everyone sounds! And I did have to show off your son peeking from behind you to my wife. Very cute!

Here is my second shot at the excercises. I think there is improvement, but I still don't feel that I have the really good sound as I am hearing from everyone on here. Still time left for making this perfect though.

[media]https://youtu.be/LjbMEReTqRY[/media]
Jack

Stewart Doyle
Student of the online lessons
Posts: 342
Joined: Sat Nov 06, 2010 9:43 pm
Location: Yorkshire,UK

Re: D02 Classical guitar lesson 5

Post by Stewart Doyle » Fri Feb 25, 2011 8:13 am

Hi Jack, definitely an improvement and a pleasure to listen to. I think some slight pauses (e.g. between the two echoing sections) would make it sound even better. If you moved your RH to get a different tone you would probably get the pause and also add some contrast to the echo.
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Antonio Lorca 3605 Cedar

Ned Henderson
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Location: North Norfolk, England

Re: D02 Classical guitar lesson 5

Post by Ned Henderson » Sun Feb 27, 2011 12:11 am

Hi Jack

I liked the clarity of the video, did you get a new computer or webcam, it looks much clearer and the camera angle was good.
I thought your playing was pretty competent, you've got the piece technically together and both left and right hand are working smoothly, a steady tempo. The RH fingers are playing straight across the strings at a right angle which is I think just what Monsieur Delcamp is advocating.
The one thing I missed - and Stewart's already flagged this up - is the varying of the tone between the theme and the repetition of the theme. Might be helpful to look again at the short piece which M. Delcamp wrote about the Allegretto which he mentions at the beginning of this lesson. It's coming along well though.

Ned H.

Duk Lee

Re: D02 Classical guitar lesson 5

Post by Duk Lee » Sun Feb 27, 2011 2:14 am

Hello Guys,

Here is another of my practice. I made sure that there is no little face behind me this time. :) [media]https://youtu.be/Ov_V0sH7Pk0[/media]
Is our next lesson coming soon?

-duk

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