What? I'm not personablefscott55 wrote:Phasing can and does result from bad room acoustics. With a good room 3:1 rule is not needed for a guitar. What I find is that there are many experts who gain their knowledge from reading, rather than actual experience. They've read that the 3:1 mic rule is required, but never ask why or why it doesn't work.
I think the best person to ask about the 3:1 rule as it applies to the guitar is legendary acoustic engineer Billy Wolf. Has nearly 40 years of recording experience and is well known in the recording world as the acoustic recording engineer. I've gained a great bit of knowledge from Billy through the years and asked about the 3:1 mic rule as it pertains to guitars. Billy will tell you it is not needed, and in most cases not preferred.
Feel free to contact wim via email or call him, he's very personable.
Wolf Productions, Inc.
2601-A Wilson Blvd.
Arlington, VA 22201
Live means dozens of things:philparker wrote:Sorry to hijack the thread, but...
Is there any advantage to using a twin mic set-up for live performance?
Thanks for the response Don, I really appreciate your experienced and knowledgeable advice. I normally play solo club, restaurant setting, weddings and small venues etc. occasionally outdoors. I used to play an electro-classical through and AER 60, but have reverted back to traditional classical. I am reluctant to fit a pick-up system to my most expensive concert CG, but I do have a less expensive concert CG (which is pleasurable to play) that I don't mind modifying.DonM wrote: Live means dozens of things:
#1 Live solo concert setting
#2 Live solo club, restaurant setting
#3 Live ensemble concert
#4 Live ensemble club, restaurant setting
I'll stop there. I have fitted some of my instruments with pickups since I have played large outdoor venues with orchestra and what's the point of being there if I can't be heard or a mic is going to pickup every thing around me plus wind. -D
Right. 89% is environment, unless you eliminate environment with close micing which has it's own obvious problems and then treat the room with non-reflective surfaces which also has it's problems. Finally the instrument matters. I can understand Why Pete would find something that works for his instrument. I 'assume' that he uses the same mics all the time as well - right?fscott55 wrote:Hehe.. now you know better.
You're correct in that everyone has their own formula for success. Engineers who find a way to do something right will usually stick to that for a long time. Obviously there are formulas for every situation. You wouldn't record a violin with stereo mics the same way you would a jumbo guitar. Different sources require different formulas. I guess I'm just pointing out the fact that sticking to a "mythical" formula like the 3:1 rule not only inhibits your recording experimentation, it may actually prevent you from exploring positions that work for you and your room acoustics. For me, room acoustics are the most important element in a good recording.
Also, the Live At Abbey Road recirding can be purchased on CD if you require higher fidelity. Pete uses that mic setup almost exclusively.
Hi Charles,charles dodgen wrote:Hi,
Thanks for all the information.
charles dodgen wrote:Hi,
Thanks for all the information.
Regarding comb-filtering, my understanding is that sound wave interactions that result in reinforcing and attenuating certain frequencies (comb-filtering) can occur in two ways: between two or more microphones' combined signals and between a source's direct and reflected sound waves' interaction in relation to the position of one microphone.
I was under the impression that the first way, between two mics, was what the 3 to 1 rule, originally pertaining to recording multiple instruments with multiple microphones that will be summed together, attempted to avoid by keeping the signal level of an instrument picked up from another microphone low enough in relation to the signal level of that instrument's assigned microphone that audible comb-filtering effects between the two signals are minimized.
Where as comb-filtering can be heard between the acoustic interaction of direct and reflected signals even when only one mic is used, isn't comb-filtering that occurs between multiple microphones, in general, only an issue when the signals are summed together, which, for solo instruments recorded in stereo (probably the main application of interest for people on this forum), they would not be?