Mcfadden thesis will blow your mind...

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crazyrach97
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Re: Mcfadden thesis will blow your mind...

Post by crazyrach97 » Tue Aug 07, 2018 12:04 am

mainterm wrote:
Mon Aug 06, 2018 8:35 pm
2handband wrote:
Mon Dec 26, 2016 2:24 pm
RobMacKillop wrote:Tecla published Aguado's major guitar method in English. But do you mean another method?
There were three. The first was the Escuela de Guitarra published in 1825 which was a "major" work as well, different from the 1843 method but not necessarily lesser. It also included a great deal of information on theory. Editions Orphee has a publication containing all of the music but stripped of text. Apparently they DID do a translation but a last-minute decision was made to not include it. The second method was op 6 and published in 1834. It was aimed at amateurs and an edition was published in English which can be had for free in the usual places. The Tecla book, which I have, is a translation of Nuevo método para guitarra published in 1843. A more complete treatise on guitar technique you'd be hard pressed to find anywhere but Aguado leaves out the theoretical material, instead advising the student to learn theory and solfege before jumping into the book.

I would pay good money for a translation of the 1825 method.
Thanks for this information - it says already in the new method that he dropped some stuff, presuming that a student will learn music theory or harmony separately (this in itself is a very interesting fact, but perhaps I'm alone in this thought). My mistake was to conflate Aguado's decision to drop the theory and harmony materials with the idea that it wasn't worth looking at.

Especially now in the context of this thread, I've started looking at the 1825 Escuela and it is super interesting. Again, apart from arguments that theory and practical matters need not mix in a guitar method... and not to lessen McFadden's work, but I agree - a translation of the 1825 text would be most helpful. Whatever time I was going to spend with the dissertation must be placed aside for another time. Aguado's 1825 text is too cool, and I must now play with that instead.

Just looking at the examples with my extremely poor Spanish skills, convinces me that anyone who is taking a serious approach to 19th century guitar and performance practice needs to read this, especially in the context of how theory - or fretboard harmony - was applied to the guitar by a top practitioner of his time - one of few guitarists Sor lauded by name. And whatever reservations one may have about the importance of Aguado as a composer, his work as a master practitioner, pioneer of nail technique and clear virtuoso (presuming he could play what he wrote!) is on clear display with his various methods.

And for those open to looking at approaches to scale cells, how they could relate more practically etc., check out Section 2, chapter V on page 73 of 1825 (and the preceding few chapters for context vis-a-vis movable chord forms).

Of course it makes sense that for most folks, practically speaking, digging in to the language is too much bother.

Either way, I'm now more convinced than at the start of this thread that McFadden's dissertation could have given us a little more historical context; and for sending me on this journey to Aguado's 1825 Escuela, I'll just say thanks to all - especially Mr. McFadden and 2handband!!
Yeah, not knowing a word of Spanish or French makes the Escuela kind of hopeless for me as far as the text goes. We do have a copy of the music-only version from Editions Orphee. What I find really interesting is that it's got tons and tons of lessons for beginners, and it all got removed from the Nuevo Methodo! I wonder what prompted THAT decision.

mainterm
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Re: Mcfadden thesis will blow your mind...

Post by mainterm » Tue Aug 07, 2018 2:45 am

crazyrach97 wrote:
Tue Aug 07, 2018 12:04 am
<snip>

What I find really interesting is that it's got tons and tons of lessons for beginners, and it all got removed from the Nuevo Methodo! I wonder what prompted THAT decision.
Well, YES. Exactly.

But the lessons are the text with musical examples. They primarily seem to consist of commentary on matter of practical theory / fretboard harmony. I can see why Aguado wouldn't keep the music bits if he was ditching the text - too likely to be misunderstood or misused.

Aguado (and Sor in a much more elegant way) both give indications that study of harmony is a separate activity, to be considered apart from a method for guitar. Maybe Aguado was just trying to bump up sales for the old method :wink:

There could be a dissertation (written or unwritten) lurking here...

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fast eddie
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Re: Mcfadden thesis will blow your mind...

Post by fast eddie » Tue Aug 07, 2018 2:57 am

Tried Univ. of Toronto website and searched for this Doctoral thesis. I found T. McFadden link but when I clicked on it I was asked for a user name and pw. Then I quit.
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guitarrista
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Re: Mcfadden thesis will blow your mind...

Post by guitarrista » Tue Aug 07, 2018 4:06 am

fast eddie wrote:
Tue Aug 07, 2018 2:57 am
Tried Univ. of Toronto website and searched for this Doctoral thesis. I found T. McFadden link but when I clicked on it I was asked for a user name and pw. Then I quit.
First go to https://tspace.library.utoronto.ca/handle/1807/24825
Then do this and you will get to it without any further screens and passwords:
utor.JPG
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Guitarthailand
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Re: Mcfadden thesis will blow your mind...

Post by Guitarthailand » Fri Oct 12, 2018 2:59 pm

Wow need to check out

AAA

Re: Mcfadden thesis will blow your mind...

Post by AAA » Mon Oct 15, 2018 2:58 pm

Looking at it now. Very interesting. And blindingly thorough.

This may indeed be a breakthrough.

AA

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