Guitar Support Recommendations

Ergonomics and Posture for Classical Guitarists, Aches and Pains, Injuries, etc...
kats45

Guitar Support Recommendations

Post by kats45 » Sat Nov 10, 2012 6:13 pm

I've read some of the threads that discuss some of the problems experienced with supports, so I wonder what your recommendation is for a guitar support. Are there any good ones for playing with the guitar on the right leg? Also, do any of the supports harm the finish of the guitar?

GuitarVlog

Re: Guitar Support Recommendations

Post by GuitarVlog » Sun Nov 11, 2012 5:32 am

I use the Gitano on my Yamaha C40. I also have an Ergoplay Troester on my main classical and four Ergoplay Tapperts on other guitars (two flamenco guitars, an OM and a Seagull dreadnought).

All three work fine. The Troester has the best adjustability while the Gitano is the most portable. It's really a matter of personal preference. When wearing old jeans or pants with smooth fabrics, I sometimes need a non-slip liner between my thigh and the Ergoplays.

I leave the supports attached to my guitars as they hang on my walls. All my guitars have polyurethane finishes. Suction cups will not damage them.

A guitar support on the right leg? I think the Neck-Up was designed for steel-string players that wanted to raise the necks of their guitars to a classical position. If I used a right-leg support, I think my guitar would feel unstable and my right hand would not fall at an angle to the strings that produces the best tone for me.

kats45

Re: Guitar Support Recommendations

Post by kats45 » Sun Nov 11, 2012 5:56 am

Thanks for the recommendations. Since I've been primarily a steel string player, I'm not so familiar with "things" classical guitar. The problem I have with traditional classical guitar position is my back. I feel twisted, plus I do have medical problems/pain with my back and neck.

JohnPierce

Re: Guitar Support Recommendations

Post by JohnPierce » Sun Nov 11, 2012 6:33 am

Search google for "de oro guitar support right leg". There's a good demo of it on the web site. YouTube has a good demo of the NeckUp by Peter Finger, both how it works and how solid it is while playing. The "how it works" demo is in German, but doesn't really need much in the way of words. As an added bonus, while looking for the NeckUp I found a video of Peppino D'Agostino using a strap for the same purpose.
[media]https://youtu.be/r7sLFgU1B7c[/media]
[media]https://youtu.be/8p_YfoaY_J4[/media]
[media]https://youtu.be/wqL3QMgm0PQ[/media]

kats45

Re: Guitar Support Recommendations

Post by kats45 » Sun Nov 11, 2012 4:39 pm

Thank you for the videos. I wonder if a guitar support on the left leg would eliminate back pain and feeling twisted. I'll check out some of the things suggested here. You guys are great! I'm loving this forum. Also, looking forward to helping others as I'm able.

GuitarVlog

Re: Guitar Support Recommendations

Post by GuitarVlog » Sun Nov 11, 2012 4:50 pm

Keep in mind that the Neck-Up attaches to the strap pin at the bottom of an acoustic guitar. Classical guitars don't come with strap pins and would therefore have to be modified.


---------------
EDIT: I experimented with having the support on the right leg (for flamenco) and I didn't like it.
---------------

Keeping the support on your left leg (i.e. the traditional position for right-handers) lets the guitar rest on 3 points: the chest, the top of the left thigh, and the top and inner right thigh.

This "tripod" creates stability and frees your left fretting hand from practically all work needed to support the neck. It also frees the right forearm from any work needed to counter-balance the guitar. I feel that these two combined produce less tension and allow both hands to move to anywhere for fretting and for tone creation.

kats45

Re: Guitar Support Recommendations

Post by kats45 » Sun Nov 11, 2012 4:59 pm

What about the "twisting" I feel with this position? Is it because I'm not supporting the guitar correctly, just not used to it, or something else?

I noticed something about the Guitarest: one shoulder was significantly higher than the other.
Last edited by kats45 on Sun Nov 11, 2012 5:23 pm, edited 1 time in total.

GuitarVlog

Re: Guitar Support Recommendations

Post by GuitarVlog » Sun Nov 11, 2012 5:03 pm

It's worth mentioning that Diego De Oro has created a new support called "Guitarest" that is supposedly suitable for left and right leg use. I've corresponded with him and considered experimenting with it. I just haven't had the time.

[media]https://youtu.be/Dxta94ndGNE[/media]

kats45 wrote:What about the "twisting" I feel with this position?
Twisting? I don't know. I don't feel any twisting.

At this point, it might be helpful for a good classical guitar teacher to examine your position. Or you might consider taking a photo of your position and posting it to the forum for evaluation.

kats45

Re: Guitar Support Recommendations

Post by kats45 » Sun Nov 11, 2012 5:18 pm

I just tried sitting in the classical position. I didn't raise the footstool as high as I've seen a lot of players do, but overall it didn't feel too bad. But because of my back problems, lately a lot in my middle back, it seemed to aggravate the "normal" spasm like feeling that I have even without playing. Hopefully, some things can find resolution medically.

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Vlad Kosulin
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Re: Guitar Support Recommendations

Post by Vlad Kosulin » Sun Nov 11, 2012 5:44 pm

Take a look at Dynarette. I just tried it on right leg, and it works as great as in classical position. But instead of large one, you might prefer the small size.
Easy test to find will you like Dynarette or not: make a roll out of bath towel or small blankette, and use it as cushion for couple days.
Regards,
Vlad
(still testing various strings with 2006 Sebastian Stenzel and Olinda OC-300)

thendrix

Re: Guitar Support Recommendations

Post by thendrix » Sun Nov 11, 2012 6:08 pm

Regarding finish, my local guitar shop would not let me try out guitars with my Ergoplay because of the suction cups, and offered a Dynarette. Both are working well for me and my once "fine" but now rather beat up Kohno.

My new guitar will arrive in January with a French polish; I am unsure what I will do then :? .

GuitarVlog

Re: Guitar Support Recommendations

Post by GuitarVlog » Sun Nov 11, 2012 6:36 pm

thendrix wrote:My new guitar will arrive in January with a French polish; I am unsure what I will do then :? .
At least French polish is supposedly easy to repair. You could either learn how to do it yourself or have a luthier do it for you.

Pierre330

Re: Guitar Support Recommendations

Post by Pierre330 » Sun Nov 11, 2012 7:21 pm

Not that I'm trying to be argumentative. However the following line from the NeckUp web site seems to to indicate that you can use it with two suction cups if there isn't an endpin:

"NeckUp is attached via a suction cup and an adjustable endpin tab or two suction cups if there is no endpin. "

Unless I'm misreading it.

In any case - I've tried the Ergoplay, the Tenuto, and the A-frame. The A-frame (which i was given by a member of the forum) is my support of choice. At least for the time being:)

kats45

Re: Guitar Support Recommendations

Post by kats45 » Sun Nov 11, 2012 7:30 pm

I looked at the Dynarette and watched a video about it. It looks like a great option. At first I couldn't understand the difference it made between the traditional classical position using a footstool, but the guy in the video said your feet can be flat on the floor. That's a big difference for someone with back problems. When I'm able I think I'll get one.

GuitarVlog

Re: Guitar Support Recommendations

Post by GuitarVlog » Sun Nov 11, 2012 9:01 pm

Pierre330 wrote:"NeckUp is attached via a suction cup and an adjustable endpin tab or two suction cups if there is no endpin. "
Yes. I think that was a later-added feature.


FWIW, I also have a large Dynarette which I've kept. I bring it along to luthier's shops whenever I need to evaluate guitars. I seldom use it for anything else. I gave away my small Dynarette to a relative who sometimes uses it with a low footstool.

I've found the Gitano and the Ergoplays to be my supports of preference. I sometimes want my guitars adjusted to sit higher and to have a steeper neck angle and the Ergoplays are excellent for those needs. Also, by leaving the Ergoplays/Gitano attached to my guitars, I'm able to just grab them off their hangers and start playing. I enjoy that convenience.

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