Inquiry about scoring programs.

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Adrian Allan
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Re: Inquiry about scoring programs.

Post by Adrian Allan » Thu Apr 12, 2018 8:21 pm

guitarrista wrote:
Thu Apr 12, 2018 8:15 pm
Sorry didn't mean to imply it was a quote - hence the singles rather than the double quotes. Was just interpreting the general sentiment.

As to complex orchestra scores - this is probably where the professional software shines - in single-voice per staff line engraving. But this is precisely not what one needs for guitar which is typically notated as a multi-voiced instrument on a single staff.
Agreed totally - perhaps it is good enough for guitar score and piano etc.

The only issue might come when somebody is making a serious effort to get their work published. Rightly or wrongly, the Finale and Sibelius are the lingua franca of publishers. They will want your score in either format, and then will tweak it to reach their standards and their house style.

Cadiz suggests that this is a matter of prejudice on the part of the publishers, but others disagree.

For most people it's probably fine, and when they reach a wall, they will at that stage ask whether something else can meet their needs.

I started on two fairly basic music programs, in the 1990s and then in the early 2000s. I moved to Sibelius when I outgrew them both, and they were holding back what I wanted to create. I suggest that people might want to discover that point for themselves, starting with the free options.
Last edited by Adrian Allan on Thu Apr 12, 2018 8:25 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Inquiry about scoring programs.

Post by guitarrista » Thu Apr 12, 2018 8:24 pm

Adrian Allan wrote:
Thu Apr 12, 2018 8:21 pm

The only issue might come when somebody is making a serious effort to get their work published. Rightly or wrongly, the Finale and Sibelius are the lingua franca of publishers.
Yes , agree.
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Re: Inquiry about scoring programs.

Post by doralikesmath » Thu Apr 12, 2018 8:35 pm

guitarrista wrote:
Thu Apr 12, 2018 8:15 pm
As to complex orchestra scores - this is probably where the professional software shines - in single-voice per staff line engraving. But this is precisely not what one needs for guitar which is typically notated as a multi-voiced instrument on a single staff.
Musescore does it just fine, for example, https://musescore.com/openscore/scores/4861738
Besides, it offers an interactive online viewer that doesn't require any add-ons or plug-ins installed. That's a big plus for me, at least. If you give Musescore a good try, you'll be surprised.
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Adrian Allan
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Re: Inquiry about scoring programs.

Post by Adrian Allan » Thu Apr 12, 2018 8:39 pm

doralikesmath wrote:
Thu Apr 12, 2018 8:35 pm
guitarrista wrote:
Thu Apr 12, 2018 8:15 pm
As to complex orchestra scores - this is probably where the professional software shines - in single-voice per staff line engraving. But this is precisely not what one needs for guitar which is typically notated as a multi-voiced instrument on a single staff.
Musescore does it just fine, for example, https://musescore.com/openscore/scores/4861738
Besides, it offers an interactive online viewer that doesn't require any add-ons or plug-ins installed. That's a big plus for me, at least. If you give Musescore a good try, you'll be surprised.
Mozart isn't exactly testing scoring to its limits.
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Re: Inquiry about scoring programs.

Post by doralikesmath » Thu Apr 12, 2018 8:52 pm

Adrian Allan wrote:
Thu Apr 12, 2018 8:39 pm
Mozart isn't exactly testing scoring to its limits.
And you probably haven't tested Musescore to its limits :wink:
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musikai
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Re: Inquiry about scoring programs.

Post by musikai » Thu Apr 12, 2018 10:19 pm

Because it was mentioned here, Dorico, for sure would be the worst solution for guitar scores at the moment as it lacks most guitar related features like guitar fingering, chord diagrams, tablature.
Besides Musescore, Primus free might be worth a try, especially when version 2 comes this year.
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Re: Inquiry about scoring programs.

Post by pogmoor » Thu Apr 12, 2018 10:38 pm

This is what the OP asked:
J. Herman wrote:
Wed Apr 11, 2018 9:11 am
I’m looking for recommendations for any good scoring software. I’m not all that computer savvy. I’ve dabbled with some but have issues with them allowing proper notation in treble clef, not allowing treble clef staves only , etc. I don’t need fancy. Just something that works well for guitar and doesn’t break the bank account. Any help is appreciated. Thanks
MuseScore very clearly meets the need for ‘something that works well for guitar’. As for how competent it is it’s instructive to consider what Daniel Spreadbury has written. He headed the team responsible for keeping Sibelius updated, the team that Avid felt they no longer needed and who were snapped up by Steinberg to develop Dorico. He must now be among those most knowledgeable about the capabilities of music scoring programs. In the earlier parts of his blog ‘Making Notes’, detailing the development of Dorico he compared particular elements of the functionality of three of what he thought the leading scoring programs against what was being planned for Dorico. Though he did not name the programs he was very clearly talking about Sibelius, Finale and MuseScore. There is absolutely no doubt that he considers MuseScore a heavyweight program.

I use Sibelius for my own arrangements because It’s the program I’ve got used to (though I now use MuseScore for writing lute tablature because it’s much better than Sibelius for this particular function) but I must say that if I was starting now I would have a look at the free options first and see which I found easiest to use.
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sxedio
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Re: Inquiry about scoring programs.

Post by sxedio » Fri Apr 13, 2018 9:23 am

guitarrista wrote:
Thu Apr 12, 2018 8:15 pm
As to complex orchestra scores - this is probably where the professional software shines - in single-voice per staff line engraving. But this is precisely not what one needs for guitar which is typically notated as a multi-voiced instrument on a single staff.
Funny enough in my early attempts at scoring I found Musescore excelled at single voice per staff for ensembles pieces, and I had to use Lilypond for proper guitar notation. Musescore has become better since.

I think we've long lost the original poster's attention with the ongoing debate on what professionals use. I am not a music professional, but in my own professional work I use a mixture of open source and proprietary software, whatever works for the task, whatever the employer is willing to pay for.
Last edited by sxedio on Fri Apr 13, 2018 10:21 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Inquiry about scoring programs.

Post by Conall » Fri Apr 13, 2018 10:08 am

J. Herman wrote:
Wed Apr 11, 2018 9:11 am
I’m looking for recommendations for any good scoring software. I’m not all that computer savvy. I’ve dabbled with some but have issues with them allowing proper notation in treble clef, not allowing treble clef staves only , etc. I don’t need fancy. Just something that works well for guitar and doesn’t break the bank account. Any help is appreciated. Thanks
I think, as often happens in this forum & elsewhere, many responders have lost sight of the OP. As far as I can see the OP is not asking "which is the very best scoring software?" or "which software is best for massive orchestral scores?" or "which software do publishers ask you to use?".
As mentioned by a few responders less interested in arguing about the (non OP questions) the recent updates of Musescore does what OP asks perfectly well for $0. Personally it's only the playing-in-in-time-on-a-midi-keyboard aspect that I like in Sibelius that I miss in Musescore.

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cadiz
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Re: Inquiry about scoring programs.

Post by cadiz » Fri Apr 13, 2018 10:34 am

Conall wrote:
Fri Apr 13, 2018 10:08 am
Personally it's only the playing-in-in-time-on-a-midi-keyboard aspect that I like in Sibelius that I miss in Musescore.
I never used this, it's not my practice, but are you aware that a new feature (MIDI out) is available since the last released version, 2.2.1?
See: https://musescore.org/en/node/208986

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Re: Inquiry about scoring programs.

Post by Conall » Fri Apr 13, 2018 11:05 am

cadiz wrote:
Fri Apr 13, 2018 10:34 am
Conall wrote:
Fri Apr 13, 2018 10:08 am
Personally it's only the playing-in-in-time-on-a-midi-keyboard aspect that I like in Sibelius that I miss in Musescore.
I never used this, it's not my practice, but are you aware that a new feature (MIDI out) is available since the last released version, 2.2.1?
See: https://musescore.org/en/node/208986
I find the feature much faster than "mousing" or "qwertying" or using music keyboard purely for pitches. I haven't yet downloaded the newest Musescore update & will check if it's now available in it. If so I may abandon Sibelius altogether.

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cadiz
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Re: Inquiry about scoring programs.

Post by cadiz » Fri Apr 13, 2018 11:15 am

Conall wrote:
Fri Apr 13, 2018 11:05 am
Musescore update & will check if it's now available in it
It's available in the MuseScore update (2.2.1), absolutely.

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pogmoor
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Re: Inquiry about scoring programs.

Post by pogmoor » Fri Apr 13, 2018 11:16 am

The current version of MuseScore certainly does have MIDI input, but I don’t know how it compares with MIDI input in Sibelius. With MuseScore it’s always worth using the latest version as it’s under such rapid development. I’m sure it won’t be long before the next point version of MuseScore 2 is available and it’s clear that version 3 is already under development.
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Re: Inquiry about scoring programs.

Post by cadiz » Fri Apr 13, 2018 11:20 am

pogmoor wrote:
Fri Apr 13, 2018 11:16 am
I’m sure it won’t be long before the next point version of MuseScore 2 is available
Again, the last version 2.2.1 was released there is a few days, and the MIDI out is one the major new features added to this version.

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Re: Inquiry about scoring programs.

Post by prawnheed » Fri Apr 13, 2018 11:38 am

cadiz wrote:
Fri Apr 13, 2018 11:20 am
pogmoor wrote:
Fri Apr 13, 2018 11:16 am
I’m sure it won’t be long before the next point version of MuseScore 2 is available
Again, the last version 2.2.1 was released there is a few days, and the MIDI out is one the major new features added to this version.
To do what he wants ie play the score into Musescore in real time, he needs the MIDI in feature. That's been there for a long time.

The new MIDI out feature lets you play the score through an external MIDI device. It has also been able to do this for a long time, but needed external software and was a bit tricky to set up. It is now easier and built in.

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