Sychra, Andrei - As From Beyond A Forrest - Video

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RobMacKillop
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Sychra, Andrei - As From Beyond A Forrest - Video

Post by RobMacKillop » Sun Dec 02, 2018 11:20 pm

Music for the Russian 7-string guitar in DGBdgbd' tuning. There is an article by Oleg Timofeyev, discussing how to play this piece on this non-commercial site: https://sarenkoandco.com/on-the-essence ... ng-guitar/

Guitar by Roman Kuznetsov of Edinburgh - on loan. It's the first guitar he has built. Unfortunately it is not for sale.


Conall
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Re: Sychra, Andrei - As From Beyond A Forrest - Video

Post by Conall » Mon Dec 03, 2018 10:55 am

Very nice Rob. I've tried this piece myself & like it.

I've been trying to read through the Russian pieces on the .ru site & generally enjoying the experience though as I've said previously I'm presently trying them in Spanish tuning + low C & D on my 8 string. I'm fairly certain I'll try Russian tuning on the 8 string once I have my 11 string.

I know that you are an aficionado of alternative tunings & alternative guitars & lutes but can I ask did you bother trying any of the Russian 7 string pieces in Spanish tuning (eg on your 10 string) just to see how much difficulty difference there is in doing so? Obviously the low open G & B can cause problems for 6 string Spanish tuned guitars but on my 8 string it's less of an issue (I can get low D open, Low G in 5th fret 7th string or 7th fret 8th string). I note too the close intervals in chords are harder & sometimes not possible in Spanish tuning (but I've re-voiced chords sometimes & it works OK). Also the fairly frequent flat keys are not easy in Spanish tuning though resonant enough on my 8 string.

Is the sound of Russian tuning an "improvement" in your opinion? I imagine it might be for the flat keys. Do you prefer aurally to Spanish tuning or do you just see it as technically better for these pieces?

Another question - have you done the opposite ie tried Spanish guitar pieces using Russian tuning? I imagine it might work for pieces in D & G major in particular.

Thanks & keep those videos coming!

Conall

PS I note Sychra is definitely one of the more accomplished & interesting composers (in terms of his pieces) over many of the other Russian guitar composers.

RobMacKillop
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Re: Sychra, Andrei - As From Beyond A Forrest - Video

Post by RobMacKillop » Mon Dec 03, 2018 11:15 am

I try to avoid trying to do everything on one guitar in one tuning. Experience has shown that it never improves over the original. A baroque lute does baroque lute music better than any other instrument. Ditto a baroque guitar, a harpsichord, a cello, etc. One of the reasons I took up the lute was to avoid all the questions and problems you outline above. But...it gets expensive! Instruments are not cheap, as you know, so if you simply MUST play music not written for your instrument and tuning, compromise is essential.

I haven't tried playing G tuning repertoire in standard tuning (if I can call it that - Russians see G tuning as standard, of course). And I certainly haven't tried playing Spanish music in G tuning. That's just crazy! :-)

No one tuning is better than another in itself, but G tuning is better for Sychra, just as standard tuning is best for Tárrega. Actually, I equate Sychra with Sor, and Sarenko with Tárrega, but that doesn't bear much analysis, as they were all quite unique.

The eight-string Spanish-style guitar can sound great in Russian tuning, plus one extra string. Here's our Mårten doing just that:


Conall
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Re: Sychra, Andrei - As From Beyond A Forrest - Video

Post by Conall » Mon Dec 03, 2018 12:13 pm

Hi Rob,

Yes, it's the expense & lack of space that stops me getting a Dresden guitar, Russian guitar, Romantic guitars of various types, 10 string Yepes type, alto 11 string etc etc! Also my wife would not be thrilled at taking over the house with instruments (it's full enough as it is).

But I've spent my life becoming a good sight reader in standard tuning so I'm a bit reluctant to change overmuch - but Russian tuning seems not too far away.

You are right that Marten's guitar / Russian tuning sound great. In fact it would be difficult at first glance & hearing that the tuning is different to regular 8 string tuning.

Any idea what guitar he uses in the recording?

Cheers,

C.

RobMacKillop
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Re: Sychra, Andrei - As From Beyond A Forrest - Video

Post by RobMacKillop » Mon Dec 03, 2018 1:02 pm

You'll find out all about when I publish my interview with him on the http://SarenkoAndCo.com website this evening :-)

RobMacKillop
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Re: Sychra, Andrei - As From Beyond A Forrest - Video

Post by RobMacKillop » Mon Dec 03, 2018 1:08 pm

PS You can listen to his 8-string Russian-tuned guitar on Spotify - an album called Alexander Vetrov: Solo Works for Russian Guitar.

Conall
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Re: Sychra, Andrei - As From Beyond A Forrest - Video

Post by Conall » Mon Dec 03, 2018 2:01 pm

I will do that, thanks

RobMacKillop
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Re: Sychra, Andrei - As From Beyond A Forrest - Video

Post by RobMacKillop » Mon Dec 03, 2018 3:14 pm

My interview with Mårten Falk is now online here: https://sarenkoandco.com/players/marten-falk/

And another with Oleg Timofeyev here: https://sarenkoandco.com/players/oleg-timofeyev/

Both are worth reading, even if you don't play the Russian 7-string guitar.

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tateharmann
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Re: Sychra, Andrei - As From Beyond A Forrest - Video

Post by tateharmann » Mon Dec 03, 2018 9:50 pm

Wow thanks for this beautiful music, Rob! I gave a quick once-over to the site - it looks great :)

Were a lot of these Russian Composers flesh players, too? Or was it a smattering of both as was popular at the time?
"One should always eat muffins quite calmly. It is the only way to eat them."

RobMacKillop
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Re: Sychra, Andrei - As From Beyond A Forrest - Video

Post by RobMacKillop » Mon Dec 03, 2018 10:07 pm

Tate, I ask that very question to Oleg Timofeyev in his interview, and he says there is no mention of nails or no nails in any of the many methods. I imagine that both existed, but it doesn't really matter which you chose.

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tateharmann
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Re: Sychra, Andrei - As From Beyond A Forrest - Video

Post by tateharmann » Tue Dec 04, 2018 4:44 am

Interesting...that seemed to be the general consensus the world over until... some lad named...Segovia...or somesuch nane lol.

I like that tip I saw on your site by Oleg to play the artificial harmonic with the thumb - I will practice that!
"One should always eat muffins quite calmly. It is the only way to eat them."

RobMacKillop
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Re: Sychra, Andrei - As From Beyond A Forrest - Video

Post by RobMacKillop » Tue Dec 04, 2018 8:14 am

I've often played false harmonics with the thumb, especially but not exclusively on the bass strings.

Marshall Dixon
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Re: Sychra, Andrei - As From Beyond A Forrest - Video

Post by Marshall Dixon » Wed Dec 12, 2018 4:59 pm

RobMacKillop wrote:
Sun Dec 02, 2018 11:20 pm
Music for the Russian 7-string guitar in DGBdgbd' tuning. There is an article by Oleg Timofeyev, discussing how to play this piece on this non-commercial site: https://sarenkoandco.com/on-the-essence ... ng-guitar/

Guitar by Roman Kuznetsov of Edinburgh - on loan. It's the first guitar he has built. Unfortunately it is not for sale.

Giving this a bump. Alot of activity on this forum and it's easy to miss things.

A lovely piece and well played.

RobMacKillop
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Re: Sychra, Andrei - As From Beyond A Forrest - Video

Post by RobMacKillop » Wed Dec 12, 2018 6:31 pm

Thanks, Marshall. Appreciated.

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